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Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

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Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#61

Post by majormajor »

xyzzyz wrote: post #46
majormajor wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if that happened... who would you blame? Russia?

The notion of "blame" isn't really useful when you're leading a country, and want to not get invaded. Moral superiority won't repel attacks of enemy troops.

Then why are we even talking about who Mearsheimer blames?

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#62

Post by 9999px »

propesh wrote: post #12

Quoted post unavailable.

This sort of braindead mindset is exactly why learning dialectical materialism is so important. You're essentially denying causality.

A bobcat is cornered by a man with a stick, the bobcat lashes out, you blame the bobcat.

You walk around a corner to see a kid hit another kid. You blame the one who did the hitting because you don't care to investigate what was happening before you rounded the corner.

There are decades of history that influence and have led up to this moment. The fact that you didn't mention NATO or the US/EU at tall is telling.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#63

Post by mesofile »

teucris wrote: post #42
wrycoder wrote: post #2

The journalist, Isaac Chotiner, thinks he's a lot smarter and in better command of history than John Mearsheimer. That's really annoying.

I thought it was great because it ended up being a debate about the different positions, rather than simply presenting Mearsheimer’s viewpoint. In the end I disagreed with both of their stances, and I felt much more informed on the potential weakness in the mainstream interpretation of current events.

Agreed, I think Chotiner was simply not being politely deferential, as has become the custom for interviews in many US media outlets. It reads to me much more like the modern custom in UK/EU media where interviewers are expected to challenge, at least to some extent, the interviewee's salient arguments. This can come across as somewhat rude, but I much prefer it to the alternative, which is that interviews become carte blanche opportunities for influential people to push unfounded assertions directly into the news stream.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#64

Post by ceilingcorner »

warner_of_doom wrote: post #38

Seeing this play out in the media reminds me of the Iraq War hysteria in 2003. Completely one-sided coverage, classic war-time propaganda (ghost of kiev), banning Russian arts and paralympians, etc. I've lost all faith in the media. Period. You may think that there is an absolute answer to this situation, but there isn't. I recommend that you study commentators and scholars such as: John Mearsheimer, Zbigniew Brezins…

I have studied this situation nonstop for the last week and I pretty much have the same opinion as you. If you ask a simple question, Cui bono? (Who benefits?) it becomes clear that it’s ultimately another military industrial complex project. The sad part is that the only real victims here are the Ukrainian people, who were led along with false promises.

Had NATO been wiser, none of this would be happening.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#65

Post by murat124 »

Ukraine crisis has a long history, we're only witnessing and recalling the last 40 years or so. Putin views Ukraine as a country which should not exist at all. This is a position that Stalin took almost a century ago before causing 5 millions Ukrainians to die from starvation. We have to understand this: West can not make Russia to change this view. With our without the support of West, whether Ukrainians want to join EU/NATO or not, no matter what West or Ukrainians do, Putin will never leave Ukraine or any other Brezhnev doctrine[1] countries alone.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brezhnev_Doctrine

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#66

Post by jesusofnazarath »

majormajor wrote: post #24
empressplay wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm Canadian. As a Canadian I am fully aware that my country exists strictly at the whim of the US. If we were to decide to form a military alliance with Russia, hosting Russian troops on our soil, Canada would be invaded by the US in a New York minute. Anyone who thinks otherwise is a fool. It sucks of course but it is what it is. That is all he is saying.

So if that happened... who would you blame? Russia?

No post body was provided.

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#67

Post by georgia_peach »

warner_of_doom wrote: post #38

Seeing this play out in the media reminds me of the Iraq War hysteria in 2003. Completely one-sided coverage, classic war-time propaganda (ghost of kiev), banning Russian arts and paralympians, etc. I've lost all faith in the media. Period. You may think that there is an absolute answer to this situation, but there isn't. I recommend that you study commentators and scholars such as: John Mearsheimer, Zbigniew Brezins…

Feels like the books written by the old hands are losing, badly, to the comic books and the movies, doesn't it?

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#68

Post by foogazi »

warner_of_doom wrote: post #38

Seeing this play out in the media reminds me of the Iraq War hysteria in 2003. Completely one-sided coverage, classic war-time propaganda (ghost of kiev), banning Russian arts and paralympians, etc. I've lost all faith in the media. Period. You may think that there is an absolute answer to this situation, but there isn't. I recommend that you study commentators and scholars such as: John Mearsheimer, Zbigniew Brezins…

> We are literally sacrificing their country and encouraging suicide.

Who is we ?

A) President Z and the Ukrainian army can literally wave the white flag and let the Russian tanks roll into Kiev - they are the ones doing the sacrifice here

B) Or President Putin can give the order to withdraw

Who else need to be involved here ?

Re: Why John Mearsheimer Blames the U.S. for the Crisis in Ukraine

#70

Post by thraneh »

warner_of_doom wrote: post #38

Seeing this play out in the media reminds me of the Iraq War hysteria in 2003. Completely one-sided coverage, classic war-time propaganda (ghost of kiev), banning Russian arts and paralympians, etc. I've lost all faith in the media. Period. You may think that there is an absolute answer to this situation, but there isn't. I recommend that you study commentators and scholars such as: John Mearsheimer, Zbigniew Brezins…

This is spot on! What has shocked me is how easily the narrative has been pushed in the EU. There has not been much backing for less confrontation. On the contrary, EU more than anything, is escalating by imposing economic sanctions on the Russian people. (Does sanctions ever do anything else than push people into poverty?) Everything appears to be designed to push Putin into a corner so he has no choice but to use those nukes. Are there any efforts at all to de-escalate the situation?
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