Live data from Hacker News

Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

skiplang.com

61–70 of 119 posts

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#61
post #10

Looks interesting but here's what I don't understand. So many programming languages do not show example code on the homepage. That's like if Mazda didn't show cars on their homepage. Sure, you won't really know what it's like to drive it without getting your hands dirty but at least let me see the trim.

what's worse, even if you click on "more info" it goes to a tutorial that teaches you from zero. But I'm more eager to know killer features in this language.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#62
post #59
post #55

"In Skip the = operator introduces a new variable, but unlike other languages the = operator alone can not modify an existing variable." Using != to assign a value feels really strange to me. I know some languages use := but in those languages typically it's because = is an equality operator. I'm sure there are some exceptions but != just so universally means "not equal" to me.

I too would prefer := or even =!

or <= which vhdl does (it differentiates between variables and signals so it uses both := and <=)

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#63
post #10

Looks interesting but here's what I don't understand. So many programming languages do not show example code on the homepage. That's like if Mazda didn't show cars on their homepage. Sure, you won't really know what it's like to drive it without getting your hands dirty but at least let me see the trim.

Maybe a feature list tells you more than a code list might show? Often syntax is the less interesting thing.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#64
post #10

Looks interesting but here's what I don't understand. So many programming languages do not show example code on the homepage. That's like if Mazda didn't show cars on their homepage. Sure, you won't really know what it's like to drive it without getting your hands dirty but at least let me see the trim.

Maybe a feature list tells you more than a code list might show? Often syntax is the less interesting thing.

I'm not sure. If we're talking about turing complete languages, aside from performace, you can get all kinds of features in all kinds of languages. It's actually a matter of how expressive, safe, idiomatic and well designed they are for everyday usage.

When discussing a language which is defined by caching values, we sure do want to see how that looks like in practice.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#65
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even worse, the "tutorial" is a challenge of sorts, where you have to guess at the right answer given hints.

The "documentation" is also tutorial-style.

We need to go deeper.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#66
post #41

> Thanks to Skip's tracking of side effects the garbage collector only has to scan memory reachable from the root of a computation But any typical copying GC only has to scan memory reachable from the root(s) of a mutator. I suspect there are more interesting optimisations, but I am unable to discern them from this statement.

Well, imagine your type-system was able to tell you exactly what roots are mutable in what scope. Now you can run a garbage collection on a single scope. That's not how it works, but in pseudo code: collect { // Some code return ...; } Well, if you don't have a type-system that tells you what is mutable, you have to either scan all the mutable roots, or maintain a write-barrier to know what could have captured data i…

So, myObject and the list are allocated in different generations/scopes/etc, and we'd typically trip the write barrier, if we kept the program as is. Right. I don't see how it follows after, that we can avoid the barrier based on just mutability information. It is true that we can only "capture" data with the involvement of mutable objects, but I am struggling to figure out what more we can derive from mutability information. It feels like I'm missing some inference step between "the only thing that can be mutated is myObject" and "now you can run that in a loop, without accumulating garbage" and I can't think of one.

I would be more tempted as a compiler writer to delete all the code, since nothing is ever read outside the loop; but such analysis again doesn't depend on mutability type information per se, rather on what mutations occur in the program.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#67
post #30
post #18

A whole homepage about a programming language, and nowhere on the page does it show the programming language. :-/

Why is seeing the syntax of a programming language so interesting? I think that syntax is one of the least interesting aspects of a programming language.

It's not about syntax, it's about quickly seeing language choices and verbosity of various constructs. There is a lot more information in a good example rather than a front page feature list.

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the spirit of testing: Mazda doesn't show cars on their home page. Here is mazda.com: Forbidden You don't have permission to access / on this server. You have to add www. to mazda.com before you can see any damn cars. And it's just one car I see; some fat SUV that looks like it's about to give birth to a pair of sporty twins.

In the USA, Mazda is at mazdausa.com, not mazda.com. There are eight cars on the front page.

So, whats your point? Does that change anything?

Re: Skip: A programming language to skip the things you have already computed

#69
post #12

It's still very much used at SkipLabs. In fact, it's the language that SQLive is written in: http://sqlive.io Unfortunately, we use a proprietary fork of SKIP, so that's why the OSS project looks dead. We might open-source our version some day, but no plans for now.

... "proprietary fork" and "might open-source"... let us know when you change your stand

Well Julien Verlaguet is the original author of SkipLang, so "proprietary fork" does not deserver the square quotes, IMO
Post reply on HN