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YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

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Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#61

Post by klyrs »

oh_sigh wrote: post #42
dynm wrote: post #12

I find this debate a little strange. My position is that youtube is a private company, they should be allowed to do whatever they want, and people should be able to choose a video service that meets their needs. If you feel that youtube is so dominant that this is cramming a "no dislikes" policy on the whole world, isn't the problem really that you think youtube is a monopoly, not dislikes per se? Edit: I clearly did…

No one has argued Youtube isn't allowed to do it. It is just customers complaining about the move. If McDonalds got rid of their Big Macs, people might complain about it, but that doesn't mean that McDonalds has a hamburger monopoly or that the complainers think McDonalds did something illegal or something they weren't allowed to do. It is just customers complaining about a feature they liked being removed.

If you go to the store, demand a Big Mac, and complain to all present that the Big Mac got cancelled, then they'd ask you to leave. And, sure, folks would be upset about being asked to leave.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#62

Post by rfrey »

1_player wrote: post #18
BitwiseFool wrote: post #6

I really hope this backfires spectacularly on YouTube and the zealots who pushed for this change are held professionally accountable. I already click on fewer videos in search results and recommendations because I can no longer gauge how worthwhile they are to try and watch. The end result? I'm sticking to my current channels. I can't be alone and knowing that YouTube takes recommended content so seriously, I have to…

Youtube doesn't f*** care. Where are you going to go watch your favorite content creators? Oh, they only upload on our platform? Thought so. They can do whatever they want and they won't lose a single user. In fact, I wanted to cancel my Youtube Premium, but I know it's not gonna affect their decision in the slightest, while I will hurt my favourite content creators as they won't get that thousandth of a cent they ge…

It may stop people exploring as much outside their current favourite creators. The issue is quickly judging the quality of unknown channels.

So no, they probably won't lose "users", but they may lose "engagement," however they're measuring that at the minute.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#63

Post by Brian_K_White »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #15
ragnot wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it does make a difference. Its a small one, but one that hits home. After all, when you see those videos online of the Biden admin with 1000s of dislikes...don't you feel that there is a segment of people out there that don't go along with the cultural zeitgeist of the internet? That maybe left-wing opinions (although dominant on the internet) may have some push back in the real world? When you lose that abil…

I don't, and I think the strongest argument against the dislike counter is that it encourages people to. Dislike counts aren't an accurate metric of what people "out there" think because they're heavily dependent on who ends up seeing the video - it's easy for a video to have lots of dislikes even though it expresses popular views, or few dislikes even though it expresses unpopular views.

Not to mention, regardless what most people think or ones self thinks, I didn't think, or didn't like, much of the most important information and concepts that have ever been told to me.

It's fine to filter entertainment by taste and preference, but having news of the world treated exactly the same way is a problem. It's not only not a good idea, it's literally not sane.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#64

Post by md2020 »

rightbyte wrote: post #33
dynm wrote: post #12

I find this debate a little strange. My position is that youtube is a private company, they should be allowed to do whatever they want, and people should be able to choose a video service that meets their needs. If you feel that youtube is so dominant that this is cramming a "no dislikes" policy on the whole world, isn't the problem really that you think youtube is a monopoly, not dislikes per se? Edit: I clearly did…

Isn't that a strawman? You can call out companies for doing crappy things with their products without advocating government intervention. Is this a new thing? I see this argument all the time. When Coca Cola made their impopular recipe change were people defending it with "oh it is a private company, haters gonna hate".

Seconded. This “private companies can do what they want” isn’t the “gotcha” many people think it is. Societal values exist independent of the specific implementations of laws meant to protect them, and in places where the law doesn’t reach—like the USA’s 1st Amendment not applying to private businesses—I think it’s still worth talking over “Hey, the law doesn’t really enforce this value here, but maybe it’s a good idea to abide by it anyway”. Saying private companies can do whatever they want is just stating the obvious and avoiding the question of what they should do.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#65

Post by jasode »

wnevets wrote: post #39

Do people actually look at the votes before watching a video? I don't think I've ever done that on YouTube. The outrage over this just seems so manufactured to me.

>Do people actually look at the votes before watching a video?

Yes, lots of people do that to avoid wasting time on bad videos.

Especially for product review videos or tutorials, the first thing I look at is the dislike count compared to the like count. If dislikes are high, it's because the reviewer didn't provide useful information. E.g. a "top 5 dash cams" where the video is simply a slide show of dashcams will have more dislikes than likes.

Dislike counts may be unreliable for politics videos but it was an accurate indicator for other topics like DIY how-tos. With the dislikes gone, I now scroll through comments first before hitting play. (But some channels disable comments so that doesn't always work.) I hope Youtube brings the dislikes counter back as their policy change is very user hostile.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#66

Post by jafitc »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #23

Is this youtube staff purposefully deleting critical comments? Or is it anti-spam algorithms getting triggered by people flooding the comments sections of videos with the same inane comments? And/or getting flagged by creators and other youtube users? Frankly, I can't see most creators wanting their youtube video comments full of "BRING BACK THE DISLIKE BUTTON", and I could see lots of their fans being annoyed by suc…

Oh the dislike button is still there. It just does nothing anymore. Isn't that what we all supposed to be? Dumb and beautiful.

What do you think about our product? interested? very interested? or very interested? which one? which one? which one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZJQDpS7ikc

With the dislike count gone you cannot make a quick judgement about what Youtube recommended to you. Less power to the people, more power to Youtube.

It's a very subtle change. Also a monumental one.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#67

Post by bobthechef »

dynm wrote: post #12

I find this debate a little strange. My position is that youtube is a private company, they should be allowed to do whatever they want, and people should be able to choose a video service that meets their needs. If you feel that youtube is so dominant that this is cramming a "no dislikes" policy on the whole world, isn't the problem really that you think youtube is a monopoly, not dislikes per se? Edit: I clearly did…

So being a private company means no one can criticize you and the detrimental effect you're having on public life? Besides, that YouTube is a monopoly isn't the main problem. Few people complain about utilities that work well. It is rather that YT has done harmful things as a monopoly.

The public/private distinction is important to respect, but according to reason. They don't live in hermetically sealed off universes as some libertarians would have you believe. Just as government can overstep, so can private business.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#68

Post by commandlinefan »

wnevets wrote: post #39

Do people actually look at the votes before watching a video? I don't think I've ever done that on YouTube. The outrage over this just seems so manufactured to me.

I don't really watch YouTube much (I don't get sitting through somebody talking about something rather than just reading it myself) but I've seen a lot of people who do use YouTube to find educational videos using the like/dislike ratio as an indicator of the quality of a video. I guess if you're about to invest a half hour in listening to somebody talk about math or computer programming, you want some indication that it's going to be a half hour well spent.

I guess I do the same when I'm thinking about buying a book about a technical topic, after all - I read the amazon reviews to see if it's going to be a waste of my time.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#69

Post by Nextgrid »

1_player wrote: post #55
Nextgrid wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> while I will hurt my favourite content creators as they won't get that thousandth of a cent they get from my Premium view. Over time this should put pressure on them to be open to a better platform and make the move as soon as such platform exists.

No, I just explained that nobody will move out of the platform because everybody's there. Where are you going to watch your favourite USB gadget reviewer that only uploads on YT? Over time means nothing until there's actually competition, and there's nothing on the horizon that can compete to the scale of YouTube. Your content creator is not moving anywhere any time soon.

Competition can only appear if there's a selling point and demand for it. If creators get paid on YT, they have less incentive to seek out an alternative. If they stop getting paid (because people like you cancel their Premium subscription) they become potential customers for an upcoming alternative that does pay them.

Re: YouTube deleting comments who criticize their hiding of the dislike count

#70

Post by BitwiseFool »

dynm wrote: post #12

I find this debate a little strange. My position is that youtube is a private company, they should be allowed to do whatever they want, and people should be able to choose a video service that meets their needs. If you feel that youtube is so dominant that this is cramming a "no dislikes" policy on the whole world, isn't the problem really that you think youtube is a monopoly, not dislikes per se? Edit: I clearly did…

>"youtube is a private company, they should be allowed to do whatever they want"

Yes? But this isn't the source of why people are upset. As far as I can tell, no one is protesting YouTube's ability to do what they did. No one is demanding the government force YouTube to reverse this decision.

I also feel like reflexive arguments like "So-and-so is a private company and can do whatever they want" is unhelpful and irrelevant to the discussion. Do I really need to be reminded that some giant corporation has control over their own platform? Was I ever under the illusion otherwise? Why is corporate criticism met with a reminder that they had the right to make the decision?

Additionally, the entwined mindset of 'you can just go somewhere else if you don't like it' is also unhelpful. Very few decisions like these are bona-fide deal-breakers.

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