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Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

welcometothejungle.com

61–70 of 110 posts

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Its shocking and gore, portraying a totalitarian sub society with hints of communism. It reminds us of North Korean. But for some reason, westerners think its a “critique of capitalism”. Edit: to clarify, the “hints of communism” here refers to the game on the island, not south korea. These people willingly left capitalism to join this weird commie authoritarian style game to make money.

> with hints of communism Seriously? It portrays current South Korea, which is one of the most capitalist societies in Asia. Did we watch the same show? In fact, most of the circumstances that bring the players in the squid game are due to poverty and failed capitalism.

It showed greedy, flawed people who _chose_ to leave a possibly capitalistic system (they actually dont discuss the outside world too much) and participate in a totalitarian hell hole as they are enticed with cash. Not out of lack of options, but due to messed up promises by the dictator in charge and their own greedy nature, or bad choices (like gambling debt, crashing a overlevered portfolio which is hardly poverty).

It is reminiscent of communist revolutions of the past where people choose to overthrow a system to establish a totalitarian system so that they can get some gain out of it.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#62

Though I've seen it a hundred and more times, I'm always a little surprised to see this community completely miss the point of artistic works that challenge inequality. Y'all seem to think that we're in some kind of meritocracy, that predatory capitalism isn't centrally planned, that you earned your position in society and so everyone who's poor just isn't working hard or smart enough... And even after watching a sho…

>How can smart people miss the point so completely?

They want to miss it so badly, it's simple cognitive dissonance. Some people don't want to accept that they had luck while others didn't. They have successfully convinced themselves that we are not all equals, that somehow there are people who are more deserving.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#63

To be completely honest I don't understand the appeal of Squid Game. It's a very thin metaphor around super shocking imagery --- and don't get me wrong, although it's not my thing, I can understand people liking slasher movies and the like, but I don't understand why this discourse that Squid Game is very deep (and anything other than cheap gore horror) became so popular.

I think many people don't reflect on the show's messaging beyond the surface level "catchy costumes and violence in a game show" aspect (which honestly wasn't even new when Arnold Schwarzenegger portrayed it in Running Man).

The social critique of Squid Game isn't the squid game. It's the world outside the game. It's why so many of the participants not only volunteer but also volunteer to come back after having already experienced it. The world outside the game show is portrayed as so bleak that hundreds of people would rather compete in a life-or-death "game" that promises fairness and a life-changing cash reward.

And the critical message of the show is that this world outside the game is not significantly different from ours. The game is a grotesque exaggeration of a get rich quick scheme but there are plenty of examples for people hoping to beat the odds or being willing to scam others for promises of great fortunes (look no further than the way the GameStock pump and dump was framed as a proletarian revolution until it was revealed most of the stock movement was the result of established investors jumping in to cash out on the gullible masses still tweeting "diamond hands" memes as the tide was starting to turn).

The cheap gore horror sells the show, but the implications of the story it tells, what people are willing to do to themselves and others for the promise of a carefree life, and how characters from all walks of life can end up in the gutter and devoid of hope, is why people dig their claws into it for more than just a few viral marketing memes. It speaks to the zeitgeist, especially during a pandemic that has repeatedly demonstrated failures of government and society, and economical interests being placed above the individual's well-being.

Before 2020 many people likely believed that their country would come together in a crisis like this, that people with power would forego their own interests for once an help out or that the wealthy wouldn't do less than even the bare minimum to contribute to the society that made them rich. In 2021 I don't think there are many people left having any such illusions about the systems they exist within.

So yeah, detached rich people betting on the dying and desperate like horses in a race strikes a chord with people right now. A show casually presenting a social reality in which poor people are willing to participate in such a "game" even more so. Note that this show's success on Netflix followed both The Platform and Snowpiercer (or the serialization thereof) as well as Parasite and Knives Out. There's a common thread between the themes of these films and Squid Game managed to strike the nerve.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#64
> Meritocracy is a fallacious idea – a convenient lie told to those whose lack of wealth or social class leaves them at a distinct disadvantage.

This is a bit oversimplified. Meritocracy is not an outright fallacious idea, but depending on the subject, there is a certain threshold of opportunity above which it becomes the dominant force, and for many that threshold is out of reach.

For instance, learning to program is fairly "accessible" today, but even it has certain minimum requirements, a threshold of opportunity above which the playground becomes more equal: You need a computer, internet access, enough free time... eventually you need a job. The one that really generalises against meritocracy is "you need free time", because most of the world is fighting for their next paycheck and are not in a position to attempt to improve their life. I believe this is what the author is getting at, wealth and "social class" are just an indirect way of saying "the freedom to pursue more opportunities".

However throwing out meritocracy completely is not the solution to this, if replaced with ideas revolving around inclusivity and equality alone it will fall apart - meritocracy is part of equality, it's just not all of it, it doesn't automatically solve equal opportunity... And this is where I think the author is missing the point: the world, society, government does little to ensure equal opportunity - This is the point squid game is making, everyone starts equal unlike reality.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#65
This is pure anecdata and somewhat tangential to the article, but - I had multiple conversations, distinct from each other and completely unprompted, where people said they thought the hype for this show was manufactured. One person in particular said Reddit felt like someone "flipped a switch" and suddenly everything was Squid Game for a week. At first I didn't see it but after the Nth article breathlessly repeating the same points about the show's message one does wonder.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#66

Though I've seen it a hundred and more times, I'm always a little surprised to see this community completely miss the point of artistic works that challenge inequality. Y'all seem to think that we're in some kind of meritocracy, that predatory capitalism isn't centrally planned, that you earned your position in society and so everyone who's poor just isn't working hard or smart enough... And even after watching a sho…

Speaking only for myself...

It's not that I'm wilfully blind to the flaws of the system I live in. It's that the overwhelming majority of people who offer critique offer absolutely nothing in the way of workable solutions. If the public intellectuals who came up with the doughnut economy, teal society, or the Rojavan system were having a talk in my town, I'd be very interested in going. But note that these people actually created something and spend very little time cataloguing flaws of the things they're seeking to replace. Nearly anyone can critique a thing that exists, and people who do nothing but criticise tend to rub everyone the wrong way.

More insidiously, there are often class interests at work motivating the criticisms or denials of meritocracy, and most people who enjoy having the chance to make a positive contribution to the world view that particular class with an extreme suspicion and often well-earned hostility. If you'd really like to understand how the other side thinks, I'd recommend this essay: https://thearchdruidreport-archive.200605.xyz/2016/01/donald...

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#67
post #5

I don't see the appeal of this show. It's a prepackaged, shallow production that adds little to the actual works it undoubtedly inspires and gets much from, FKMT's manga.

The interesting thing to me is its popularity. Back in 2007, the same people that are now singing praises to SG would not have looked twice at Kaiji. In fact, I bet that had SG not been popular, the very same people would not watch it or allow themselves to enjoy it. In other words, it seems to me that it first had to be publicly announced as 'popular', before people would consider watching it thus actually making it…

> Back in 2007

Back in 2007, Netflix wasn't a globally available streaming service and they were still sending out DVDs.

> would not have looked twice at Kaiji

I still wouldn't, it's a cartoon, I'm not into cartoons.

> it first had to be publicly announced as 'popular'

I didn't figure out it was popular until after I finished watching the show. Meanwhile, while watching the show, I was telling all my friends about how much I liked it and recommended it to them.

Your comment reeks of "I have superior taste and people who watch Squid Game are sheep". Just accept that some people might just really like this show while not being interested in the Manga you enjoy.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#68
post #58
post #5

I don't see the appeal of this show. It's a prepackaged, shallow production that adds little to the actual works it undoubtedly inspires and gets much from, FKMT's manga.

Yes. Basically it is a re-branded, re-heated and re-packaged entertainment version of today's rat race. Unfortunately, lots of people are just easily impressed by what influencers are watching or what is 'trending' these days. So they follow the hype squad around; like sheep. It is great for Netflix's business since they have a successful hit, but count me out of the hype squad; since I simply cut through the hype.

No, it is not. It is objectively good. Tons of people have tried to make films like that and have failed. It's not a matter of rehashing the same old ideas and hopefully the writer hits the lottery and can enjoy never ending days on the beach.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> with hints of communism Seriously? It portrays current South Korea, which is one of the most capitalist societies in Asia. Did we watch the same show? In fact, most of the circumstances that bring the players in the squid game are due to poverty and failed capitalism.

It showed greedy, flawed people who _chose_ to leave a possibly capitalistic system (they actually dont discuss the outside world too much) and participate in a totalitarian hell hole as they are enticed with cash. Not out of lack of options, but due to messed up promises by the dictator in charge and their own greedy nature, or bad choices (like gambling debt, crashing a overlevered portfolio which is hardly poverty…

Boy did you completely miss the meaning of it.

They all live in a strongly capitalist society, which works in the same way as the squid game does, just less gory but still brutal. It is still a competitive race to the top where the losers are left behind. That's exactly capitalism and meritocracy for you, if you didn't get it yet.

What the squid game organizers offer to them is, at least for once a fair-ish opportunity. The players all take it, even if they know they will very probably die. It is still fairer to them than a life in the capitalist hellhole that is South Korea in the show.

Re: Sorry, but you're already living in the “Squid Game”

#70
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The acting is superb, I really have not seen a single actor fail to deliver. They are all shocked beyond reason given the circumstances. It's like watching what would happen in real life. It has high realism precisely because not everyone believes in a dog eat dog world. There are those that sacrifice themselves to save someone else. The immigrant that believes he is inferior simply because he came to the land and yo…

> The acting is superb, I really have not seen a single actor fail to deliver. Have you seen the episode with the VIPs? They are terrible across the board. Their delivery sounds like NPC background dialogue from a third-rate low-budget video game.

FWIW aside from the delivery working better alongside the original Korean (which seems appropriate for a series made for a Korean audience first), the dialogue was intentionally aloof and pretentious (while also being tasteless and crass). I don't recall the exact quotes but the actors pretty much stated that their instructions boiled down to channeling the spirit of the equivalent of a fedora wearing teenage 4chan user: stilted to make up for a lack of sophistication but also deviantly self-indulgent and crass.
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