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Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

arstechnica.com

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Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#61

Post by GekkePrutser »

yosito wrote: post #29

Google Maps may silently be Alphabet's most powerful property. As someone who has spent the last 8 months religiously degoogling my life, I've found that Google Maps features are incredibly hard to replace, while at the same time, giving Google direct abilities to influence behavior in the physical world. People see it as "just a map", but it's so much more. OSM-based map tools are pretty good as maps, but they utter…

I think OSM is amazing. Way better at mapping than Google. When I hike I'm just walking in a green square in Google maps. OSM has every trail and hillslope etc.

But what OSM lacks is real-time integration with public transport. If my bus is slow or redirected Google will tell me. I don't think this can be improved by the users. It really needs a data feed from the transport operators :'(

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#62

Post by YetAnotherNick »

giga_chad wrote: post #26

Google has us all by the balls. As a small business owner, in my particular market, I can't survive without their services, even though they suck and I hate them, and their entire company. My business can be destroyed by Google on a whim at a moment's notice. How did it get to be so bad?

That's an odd way to frame it. "even though they suck" they don't suck in giving you free traffic though and your complain is that they could stop giving it?

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#63

Post by KronisLV »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #61
yosito wrote: post #29

Google Maps may silently be Alphabet's most powerful property. As someone who has spent the last 8 months religiously degoogling my life, I've found that Google Maps features are incredibly hard to replace, while at the same time, giving Google direct abilities to influence behavior in the physical world. People see it as "just a map", but it's so much more. OSM-based map tools are pretty good as maps, but they utter…

I think OSM is amazing. Way better at mapping than Google. When I hike I'm just walking in a green square in Google maps. OSM has every trail and hillslope etc. But what OSM lacks is real-time integration with public transport. If my bus is slow or redirected Google will tell me. I don't think this can be improved by the users. It really needs a data feed from the transport operators :'(

I've found that overall, for public transport, HERE maps is a feasible alternative in most cases, here's a quick example of how a route might look (though there is a mobile app available as well, IMO the performance is much better than Google Maps'): https://wego.here.com/directions/publicTransport/Riga-Intern...

Now, of course, Google probably still has more real time data in this regard, especially since it's possible for them to aggregate it due to a large amount of users and so on.

It would be nice to have more FOSS projects pop up that would deal with providing company listings and reviews on the map like Google does, as well as would provide more real time transport information as well. But hey, at least OSM gives us a really good starting point, the rest is a matter of building it and getting the data!

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#64

Post by izacus »

netcan wrote: post #42
t0mas88 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They can do what they want, but it's the role of the media to call out bullshit so the public is more informed. That's what this article is doing, pointing out how extreme Google is framing things here while the thruth could be very different.

I disagree. First, Google (and FB/amzn, which also have dogs in this) are extremely powerful within the media industry. So, their shadow looms very long here. Second, thinking of these issues as running via media through to an informed public to an attentive political structure is far too naive. Political mechanisms are rarely about for Vs against. It's about defining the debate, legislation and it's details. Google…

> First, Google (and FB/amzn, which also have dogs in this) are extremely powerful within the media industry. So, their shadow looms very long here.

In what way? They've received nothing but trashing from media these last few years and very little positive coverage.

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#65

Post by giga_chad »

YetAnotherNick wrote: post #62
giga_chad wrote: post #26

Google has us all by the balls. As a small business owner, in my particular market, I can't survive without their services, even though they suck and I hate them, and their entire company. My business can be destroyed by Google on a whim at a moment's notice. How did it get to be so bad?

That's an odd way to frame it. "even though they suck" they don't suck in giving you free traffic though and your complain is that they could stop giving it?

Yes, what gave it away?

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#66

Post by YetAnotherNick »

jiggawatts wrote: post #7
vosper wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn’t Google put a lot of the POI data together themselves? And aren’t there lots of competitors? And nothing but money stopping another player from entering the market?

When Apple Maps got released and everbody made fun of how bad it was, it was revealed that Google Maps had something like 6000 people working on it for years and years, funded through Alphabet corporation's search monopoly and ad revenue. Not the maps ad revenue, that's a pittance. The search revenue. And note that a company that was the world's biggest (or nearly so) at the time failed to catch up, and has still fai…

> Not the maps ad revenue, that's a pittance

Source? I was under the impression maps are profitable for Google.

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#67

Post by y4mi »

amelius wrote: post #59
yosito wrote: post #29

Google Maps may silently be Alphabet's most powerful property. As someone who has spent the last 8 months religiously degoogling my life, I've found that Google Maps features are incredibly hard to replace, while at the same time, giving Google direct abilities to influence behavior in the physical world. People see it as "just a map", but it's so much more. OSM-based map tools are pretty good as maps, but they utter…

> Google Maps may silently be Alphabet's most powerful property. Except it's easy for a competitor to scrape Maps and build their own using OSM.

Except it's not. Apple has basically unlimited resources and tried. While it's a decent navigation option at this point, it continues to fall short wrt everything else if compared to Google maps.

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#68

Post by gambiting »

yosito wrote: post #29

Google Maps may silently be Alphabet's most powerful property. As someone who has spent the last 8 months religiously degoogling my life, I've found that Google Maps features are incredibly hard to replace, while at the same time, giving Google direct abilities to influence behavior in the physical world. People see it as "just a map", but it's so much more. OSM-based map tools are pretty good as maps, but they utter…

I think we'll have to have regulators step in at some point in another area - nowadays more and more cars are shipping with Android Automotive where Google Maps are the main(and only) map provider for the satnav. So no matter how you feel about Google - you have to use their product to operate the car fully.

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#69

Post by kortilla »

YetAnotherNick wrote: post #62
giga_chad wrote: post #26

Google has us all by the balls. As a small business owner, in my particular market, I can't survive without their services, even though they suck and I hate them, and their entire company. My business can be destroyed by Google on a whim at a moment's notice. How did it get to be so bad?

That's an odd way to frame it. "even though they suck" they don't suck in giving you free traffic though and your complain is that they could stop giving it?

That’s quite often how people view protection rackets. It’s very easy to hate a monopoly that has infested your life.

People used to depend on at&t for business and still hate it back when they owned the entire phone system (including the phone on the wall).

Re: Google sends anti-regulation propaganda to small businesses using Google Maps

#70

Post by chrisjc »

Freak_NL wrote: post #22
slownews45 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some people are even using google street view to do this - not sure what the licensing rules if any are there.

Don't stimulate this. It is a legal grey area and actively discouraged by the OSM community. It's just too close to directly copying from Google Maps, which is infringement of their IP. Morally speaking, any information you derive from a photograph taken in a public area should not be encumbered in any way, but Google's pockets are a little too deep to risk a lawsuit for OpenStreetMap.

Be especially careful if you come across an island that you've never noticed before in any of the photos that you're using.
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