61–70 of 87 posts
let's index millions of people's personal and health data, including their exposure to dna-altering drugs that might have health repercussions for years afterwards... and secure them so well than some kid can create and sign a record for a mister adolf Hitler. what can go wrong?
[1]: https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-covid-mrna-gene-id...
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It is a success for the European Union. Not for the Europeans! I'm vaccinated and prefer to be around vaccinated people. Because of health? Yes. But also because of the mindset of people. But why is it not a success for Europeans? We had super easy travel before Covid - no borders - free settlement, travel and work. You've just carry your ID with you. Regarding the stolen keys? I'm afraid similar things will happen a…
> I'm vaccinated and prefer to be around vaccinated people. Because of health? Yes. But also because of the mindset of people - I'm well-trained and prefer to be around well-trained people - I'm classically educated and prefer to be around classically educated people - I'm an atheist and prefer to be around atheists - I'm Christian and prefer to be around Christians - I'm Hindu and prefer to be around Hindus - I'm Mu…
> SARS2 is not a big threat to vaccinated people. Why the hysteria?
Even if we assume that it's not a threat to the vaccinated, it is still very much a threat to the non-vaccinated. All sorts of pandemic measures are designed to help society as a whole, not just the individual obeying the rules.
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Sure. I've edited my comment to indicate that the application "eases" the limiting of movement of people within the EU. It serves no other purpose.
It doesn't ease the limiting of movement though - it actually restricts the ability of countries within the EU to limit movement, easing the movement itself. If the EU had taken no action to create the EU DCC and the associated regulation, countries would be freer to limit movement than they are now.
It could be worse without the certificate for sure. But I don't think that all this extra effort to set up the system, to deal with falsifications etc. was worth it. The EU could simply make a law requiring to accept the vaccination proof of any country and that would be it.
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When are the participating countries going to get rid of it? When is the pandemic over?
If transmission rates stay under 1 over the winter, I would expect (hope) next summer we can kill it for good. Not gonna happen, sadly, as long as there are irresponsible neighbours like the UK, where I sadly happen to live (for my sins).
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> I'm vaccinated and prefer to be around vaccinated people. Because of health? Yes. But also because of the mindset of people - I'm well-trained and prefer to be around well-trained people - I'm classically educated and prefer to be around classically educated people - I'm an atheist and prefer to be around atheists - I'm Christian and prefer to be around Christians - I'm Hindu and prefer to be around Hindus - I'm Mu…
Willing to mingle with people very different from yourself is a very new phenomenon and certainly not widespread. It's nice that you can look past the differences. > SARS2 is not a big threat to vaccinated people. Why the hysteria? Even if we assume that it's not a threat to the vaccinated, it is still very much a threat to the non-vaccinated. All sorts of pandemic measures are designed to help society as a whole, no…
...which is irrelevant in the context of this discussion which centres around a vaccinated person preferring to avoid unvaccinated people.
It is strange how the vaccinated seem to be the ones most scared of the disease while the unvaccinated just get on with their lives. Many of those unvaccinated people have had SARS2 and as such have better immunity than any vaccine can give them, even more are in the age brackets where SARS2 is no serious threat. Most will have a full set of childhood vaccinations but are wary of these new vaccines which do not have a long safety record like the aforementioned childhood vaccines. A small group will be opposed to any and all vaccines, even though many if not most of them will have gotten vaccinated as children. For some reason the latter group is used as a marker for all unvaccinated people but the same is - fortunately - not true for the vaccinated group or I would be considered like one scared of his own shadow, not being able to cope with any risk now matter how small. It should not be true for the unvaccinated either but alas, that ship has sailed.
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Willing to mingle with people very different from yourself is a very new phenomenon and certainly not widespread. It's nice that you can look past the differences. > SARS2 is not a big threat to vaccinated people. Why the hysteria? Even if we assume that it's not a threat to the vaccinated, it is still very much a threat to the non-vaccinated. All sorts of pandemic measures are designed to help society as a whole, no…
> Even if we assume that it's not a threat to the vaccinated, it is still very much a threat to the non-vaccinated ...which is irrelevant in the context of this discussion which centres around a vaccinated person preferring to avoid unvaccinated people. It is strange how the vaccinated seem to be the ones most scared of the disease while the unvaccinated just get on with their lives. Many of those unvaccinated people…
> It is strange how the vaccinated seem to be the ones most scared of the disease while the unvaccinated just get on with their lives.
I don't see how that is strange at all. Clearly the vaccinated people are much more likely to consider the virus to be a serious threat as compared to the unvaccinated who tend to brush it off as either a minor annoyance or straight up fake propaganda.
This can be seen in all sorts of other areas. It's the climate scientists who are most scared of climate change, it's the cryptographers who are most scared of broken cryptography, it's the educated who are most scared of drinking from the same river the village pees in.
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Sure. I've edited my comment to indicate that the application "eases" the limiting of movement of people within the EU. It serves no other purpose.
It doesn't ease the limiting of movement though - it actually restricts the ability of countries within the EU to limit movement, easing the movement itself. If the EU had taken no action to create the EU DCC and the associated regulation, countries would be freer to limit movement than they are now.
That being said, it is a tool built for a single purpose. "Papers, please".
If we're lucky, the scope of use for this tool will not expand. I don't like having to get lucky.
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When are the participating countries going to get rid of it? When is the pandemic over?
The virus didn't gave us an ETA of its demise. It will probably stay longer than ideal since not every country in the Europe has high vaccination rates as Portugal. It's seriously puzzling to see he immense belief in the governments power. How on earth one can demand a specific day for removal of management tools against the natural processes?
We just seem to lack some political will to be more expedient in declaring the pandemic endemic and herd immunity achieved. In any case, when I look at the same situation in Europe, there are plenty of countries that are in the same boat. Population antibody levels by now are higher than what was claimed as the threshold needed to avert disaster. We've all been doing that.
So it's insufficient to keep accepting "probably longer than idea." That is too vague and nebulous and allows too much to go wrong. Government has more power than you realize and its government imposing these "management tools" as a cudgel against free movement and liberty. The situation in Australia [2], for example, should alarm everyone - especially those on the side of granting the powers that be basically unlimited license to do whatever they want to solve this.
If the ship has sailed due to the antibodies, then what need is there for this vagueness?
[0] - https://www.science.org/content/article/having-sars-cov-2-on...
"The natural immune protection that develops after a SARS-CoV-2 infection offers considerably more of a shield against the Delta variant of the pandemic coronavirus than two doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine, according to a large Israeli study that some scientists wish came with a “Don’t try this at home” label. The newly released data show people who once had a SARS-CoV-2 infection were much less likely than never-infected, vaccinated people to get Delta, develop symptoms from it, or become hospitalized with serious COVID-19."
[1] - miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article253987048.html
"More than 80% of Americans have coronavirus antibodies acquired through infection or vaccination, according to a new study of over 1.4 million blood donations across the U.S."
[2] - https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/09/pandemic-a...
Please read this in its entirety and actually ponder it deeply.
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When are the participating countries going to get rid of it? When is the pandemic over?
If transmission rates stay under 1 over the winter, I would expect (hope) next summer we can kill it for good. Not gonna happen, sadly, as long as there are irresponsible neighbours like the UK, where I sadly happen to live (for my sins).
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/coronavirus/article25398704...
"More than 80% of Americans have coronavirus antibodies acquired through infection or vaccination, according to a new study of over 1.4 million blood donations across the U.S."
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>By generating Adolf Hitlers GreenPass .. TBH that is pretty hitlarious :) Though it could get you in trouble in Austria and Germany.
When a German security team discovered problems with vaccination certificates, they generated a card for Robert Koch [0]. Really better way to demonstrate the vulnerability without offending people. [0] https://www.dw.com/en/security-flaws-uncovered-in-eu-vaccina...
Who was offended?