Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022 • Hacker News Board

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#61

Post by paxys » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:24 PM UTC

caeril wrote: post #21

What I'll never understand is why carmakers don't take advantage of this situation and address a market that's been literally BEGGING for decades for a new product: A simple, basic car, with the ONLY electronic control being for: - Valve timing - Fuel injection - Oxygen and throttle - Emissions There's a market for budget and privacy oriented customers that all carmakers seem to have ignored for two decades now. Give…

Almost everything you have mentioned are expensive add-ons. Any budget base model car today comes only with stuff mandated by law and little else.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#62

Post by turbinerneiter » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:25 PM UTC

carlmr wrote: post #35

turbinerneiter wrote: post #24

I hope a lot of car industry supply chain managers are losing their jobs now. Worst people ever. Hurt their suppliers, hurt their own company, out of sheet arrogance and ignorance. On the other hand, good for us, any ICE car or car in general that is not produced is good for the environment.

It's not like the supply chain managers had much choice in this. For years they would have been fired for keeping too much stock around.

True. Whoever made these choices then. Incompetent management. 100s of workers are losing their jobs because of them.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#63

Post by 88840-8855 » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:25 PM UTC

folli wrote: post #41

88840-8855 wrote: post #17

Edit: Too many downvotes for my view that this Opel case is yet another symptom of the wrong handling of the panedmic by any governments, leading to inflation and supply chain disruptions. If opinions are downvoted then I do not need to participate.

Any proof that there's a significant inflation ongoing?

CPI in Germany

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#64

Post by outside1234 » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:27 PM UTC

caeril wrote: post #21

What I'll never understand is why carmakers don't take advantage of this situation and address a market that's been literally BEGGING for decades for a new product: A simple, basic car, with the ONLY electronic control being for: - Valve timing - Fuel injection - Oxygen and throttle - Emissions There's a market for budget and privacy oriented customers that all carmakers seem to have ignored for two decades now. Give…

You probably want ABS as well - and then everyone else will want their favorite feature - and pretty soon we'll be where we are.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#65

Post by outside1234 » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:28 PM UTC

ohmaigad wrote: post #36

kayone wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

most things you mention are mandated by the government, you can't sell a car in any western market without tire pressure monitoring, stability control, back up camera etc. the manufacturers have no choice, it would be like suggesting they sell cars without seatbelts.

Back up cameras are not mandatory until May 2022 in the EU.

Cars designed at least three years before they are shipped - so May 2022 might as well be tomorrow in car time.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#66

Post by baybal2 » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:28 PM UTC

The aspect of the problem not talked about is that a lot of automotive chips are really, really old.

And they are old, because of many certification requirements set partially by the industry, and a few odd governments.

In reality, most of them are both less reliable, and harder to work with in comparison to open market parts.

The only two things I seen chips with micron scale nodes used in my life were: air conditioner boards, and car parts.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#67

Post by mlavin » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:28 PM UTC

caeril wrote: post #21

What I'll never understand is why carmakers don't take advantage of this situation and address a market that's been literally BEGGING for decades for a new product: A simple, basic car, with the ONLY electronic control being for: - Valve timing - Fuel injection - Oxygen and throttle - Emissions There's a market for budget and privacy oriented customers that all carmakers seem to have ignored for two decades now. Give…

Buy an old Dodge W250 with a 12-valve Cummins 6BT, and enjoy mechanical fuel injection and 160 hp. No emissions control, no timing chain or belt, no overhead cams, no aluminum block or heads, ABS is optional, no airbags.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#68

Post by foobarian » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:29 PM UTC

blfr wrote: post #34

clintonb wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the _market_ begging, or a few folks on the internet? The only folks I know that complain about technology in cars are a couple posters on internet forums.

Yeah, I don't like how overcomplicated many products are becoming but even then wouldn't buy a car without at least AC and Bluetooth.

My must-have now is the backup camera with steering integration. I can hook up a trailer like a god now.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#69

Post by emidln » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:29 PM UTC

_moof wrote: post #32

kenniskrag wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tire pressure sensor, gps and e-call is needed by law.

And I'm not sure what kinds of pressure sensors cars use, but I can tell you the ones I need have been impossible to source for months.

TPMS works by calculating the RPM of the wheel and knowing the tire size and vehicle speed. Most TPMS setups don't know the actual pressure, they infer it.

Re: Chip shortage leads carmaker Opel to shut German plant until 2022

#70

Post by caeril » Thu, Sep 30, 2021, 6:29 PM UTC

clintonb wrote: post #26

caeril wrote: post #21

What I'll never understand is why carmakers don't take advantage of this situation and address a market that's been literally BEGGING for decades for a new product: A simple, basic car, with the ONLY electronic control being for: - Valve timing - Fuel injection - Oxygen and throttle - Emissions There's a market for budget and privacy oriented customers that all carmakers seem to have ignored for two decades now. Give…

Is the _market_ begging, or a few folks on the internet? The only folks I know that complain about technology in cars are a couple posters on internet forums.

Sure, lots of internet people who don't want to be tracked (license plate readers notwithstanding).

But also plenty of IRL people complaining about how, for example, they miss their $10k pickup with no power anything that worked great for anytime they needed to haul material X from location M to N, but now you need to drop a minimum of $50k for a vehicle you might use once per weekend to haul gravel, insulation, cement, lumber, furniture, etc.

Trucks are a particularly big market for this idea. It's a vehicle you use when you're already dirty and sweaty from work/projects and don't care about comfort, and serves a primary purpose: moving heavy and/or large items.

But the big carmakers have opted to cater to the market that doesn't actually use trucks for their actual purpose, but rather the market that buys trucks as commuter vehicles.