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A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

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Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#61

Post by least »

bluecatswim wrote: post #37
foxpurple wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a hacker news comment. Somehow a group of people supposedly good at using computers struggle to work out what a button is while the average user seems to have no problems.

The real hacker news-ish comments are the ones like yours posting cheap "gotchas" and pointing out hypocrisies where there are none every time someone says something similiar. An engineer sees structural problems with buildings and bridges where people who use them everyday don't. An english major can see a problem with the language used in a newspaper where thousands of other readers don't. There is nothing unusual…

Are programmers really UI/UX experts, though? If you said a programmer pointing out how stupid programming is shown in film you might have a point but I really don't think many of these people pointing out their perceived flaws in UI/UX are experts.

In any thread that mentions UI/UX something like this always comes up where someone is bemoaning current UI/UX and hearkening to the good old days of when UI/UX was good, which just so happens to coincide with when they really started getting into computing.

That isn't to say that laymen can't make arguments with regards to poor UX/UI because it's ultimately a subjective experience and what is intuitive to one person isn't necessarily going to be the same for another. I just think you're conferring expertise to undeserving recipients.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#62

Post by DoingIsLearning »

eeegnu wrote: post #14
dqv wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been feeling that way, but I can't tell if it's rational. Windows XP and 7 were the versions of the OS I used the most growing up. Nostalgia? Ever since Windows 8, the OS has felt a lot slower and the UI isn't consistent. I was running something the other day that needed privilege escalation and I had this realization that I would have no idea if a particular UI was cobbled-together-Microsoft-UI or if it was cob…

Windows 7 had a very professional feel to me that subsequent versions lack. Probably has to do with attempting to create a unified tablet / phone / desktop experience.

Best example for me is in windows 10 professional, the blue screen shows you a sad smiley face.

Someone designed this and thought it was a good idea to have this in a 'professional' distribution of an OS.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#63

Post by Const-me »

least wrote: post #61
bluecatswim wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real hacker news-ish comments are the ones like yours posting cheap "gotchas" and pointing out hypocrisies where there are none every time someone says something similiar. An engineer sees structural problems with buildings and bridges where people who use them everyday don't. An english major can see a problem with the language used in a newspaper where thousands of other readers don't. There is nothing unusual…

Are programmers really UI/UX experts, though? If you said a programmer pointing out how stupid programming is shown in film you might have a point but I really don't think many of these people pointing out their perceived flaws in UI/UX are experts. In any thread that mentions UI/UX something like this always comes up where someone is bemoaning current UI/UX and hearkening to the good old days of when UI/UX was good,…

> something like this always comes up

Unsurprisingly.

> which just so happens to coincide with when they really started getting into computing

On my first job I've used Windows NT 4. Yet I agree with GP Windows 7 was the peak UX.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#64

Post by least »

Const-me wrote: post #63
least wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are programmers really UI/UX experts, though? If you said a programmer pointing out how stupid programming is shown in film you might have a point but I really don't think many of these people pointing out their perceived flaws in UI/UX are experts. In any thread that mentions UI/UX something like this always comes up where someone is bemoaning current UI/UX and hearkening to the good old days of when UI/UX was good,…

> something like this always comes up Unsurprisingly. > which just so happens to coincide with when they really started getting into computing On my first job I've used Windows NT 4. Yet I agree with GP Windows 7 was the peak UX.

The comment about it coinciding when they started was slightly tongue-in-cheek, but surprisingly often holds true. My comment more broadly is just pointing out that most people making these arguments are doing so subjectively while framing them as objective.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#65

Post by AshamedCaptain »

foxpurple wrote: post #32
superasn wrote: post #28

What I love about these old designs is how obvious everything is. You just can't miss the button or the tabs. Now after all this skeuomorphic design revolution it's so hard to tell, is it a button, text, link etc. It probably looks better but it is at the cost of extra thinking for the user.

This is such a hacker news comment. Somehow a group of people supposedly good at using computers struggle to work out what a button is while the average user seems to have no problems.

And by the way, sure one can probably figure out whether it's a button or not after some time of careful analysis. The problem is that if instead of it taking me 10ms to figure out it's a button I have to pause and understand it and it takes me 10 seconds, I get annoyed.

I have this problem right now with Firefox Proton. Since it has problems respecting my color scheme, it takes me some time to distinguish (in an inactive-colored titlebar) which is the damn currently active tab. Before, I would be able to do it almost subconsciously, without distracting me from my current goal. Now, my train of thought has to stop and search for the damn button, then I have to restart my thoughts. And we all know how that hurts.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#66

Post by arendtio »

bluecatswim wrote: post #37
foxpurple wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a hacker news comment. Somehow a group of people supposedly good at using computers struggle to work out what a button is while the average user seems to have no problems.

The real hacker news-ish comments are the ones like yours posting cheap "gotchas" and pointing out hypocrisies where there are none every time someone says something similiar. An engineer sees structural problems with buildings and bridges where people who use them everyday don't. An english major can see a problem with the language used in a newspaper where thousands of other readers don't. There is nothing unusual…

At least we can agree, that it is a typical hacker new-ish discussion ;-)

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#67

Post by tazjin »

foxpurple wrote: post #32
superasn wrote: post #28

What I love about these old designs is how obvious everything is. You just can't miss the button or the tabs. Now after all this skeuomorphic design revolution it's so hard to tell, is it a button, text, link etc. It probably looks better but it is at the cost of extra thinking for the user.

This is such a hacker news comment. Somehow a group of people supposedly good at using computers struggle to work out what a button is while the average user seems to have no problems.

The average user has no idea how to use most UIs these days. I have to explain basics of her phone to my mum every time I try to video call her.

The difference between tech people and people like her is that it's easier for us to notice these issues and talk about them, while - if something doesn't work for her - she'll just shrug and go tend to the garden.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#68

Post by Const-me »

least wrote: post #64
Const-me wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> something like this always comes up Unsurprisingly. > which just so happens to coincide with when they really started getting into computing On my first job I've used Windows NT 4. Yet I agree with GP Windows 7 was the peak UX.

The comment about it coinciding when they started was slightly tongue-in-cheek, but surprisingly often holds true. My comment more broadly is just pointing out that most people making these arguments are doing so subjectively while framing them as objective.

> most people making these arguments are doing so subjectively while framing them as objective

On subjects like that, I don't believe objective arguments are even possible. UX is similar to art or politics, it's inherently subjective because it's about people and culture. Ask a caveman to compare UX of Windows 7 and 10, and they gonna tell both are equally useless.

Despite no objective arguments is possible, it might exist a consensus.

Re: A CSS framework to recreate Windows 7 GUI

#69

Post by zhte415 »

hughrr wrote: post #44
foxpurple wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is such a hacker news comment. Somehow a group of people supposedly good at using computers struggle to work out what a button is while the average user seems to have no problems.

Have you sat with an average user? They have no idea what they are doing with these modern UIs. My mother with an iPhone is a fine example. Has no idea what to press or slide. She could use windows 7 fine. Anything later, more difficult.

I have trouble with an iPhone.

A friend passed me his back in 2011ish to call his wife letting her know he'd be late to pick her up. It utterly confused me. No back button. A million apps on the 'home' screen. Needing to swipe in an undocumented manner, at least undocumented via a 20 second conversation.

The last Apple product I'd owned, an iPod mini, had useful things like buttons. And despite buttons it managed to have unintuitive features such as sticking music in multiple machine-named folders that only iTunes understood and a proprietary connector. So I dropped the iPod mini and went with something no-brand that was a USB stick that went in a small cradle that had a small battery; it had buttons, it functioned as a music player, it had a sane file system, it was charged via USB, I was happy.

I still have trouble with iPhones.

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