I'm not quite sure I understand the aversion to Russian teaching materials, other than a lingering negative reaction to communism. Gelfand's Algebra has become a real game-changing text for a lot of English-speaking students who struggle with the subject. His Trigonometry book is just as good, and helped me a lot when I needed a refresher when I became a land surveyor after being out of school for years.
American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
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Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
> school's curriculum is based on Russian teaching traditions that emphasize reasoning and deeper understanding early on, not just memorization and practice drills. "The child should be brought to abstract level as soon as possible," she says, "meaning early introduction of algebra and geometry, not only arithmetic," and helping children figure out principles for themselves rather than spoon-feeding them.
I buy into having a deeper understanding, and in both work and school, it's pretty clear who has a deeper understanding and who's going through the motions. That said, how is it that there's such range in pedagogy? So many people have studied teaching that you'd think we'd have a better idea of what works. Or maybe it's that goals are different.
The goals are different. The goal of the Russian school is to teach math. The goal of public schools is to dumb down the curriculum until everyone is equal.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It is bound to hurt poorer but smart kids, that can't afford private tutoring and have to rely only on public schools Why should I care about them? The internet exists. Let them learn on their own if they’re so interested. Why am I being forced to subsidize people that will just grow to resent me as a leech on society due to my “inferior mathematical ability” as you surely do? Poverty is a far bigger problem than s…
> Why should I care about them? We should obviously care about improving education, for the good of society as a whole, for innovation, for pushing the economy forward, etc. It's dumbfounding that this would even be asked, I'm not sure anyone outside of America (i.e. no pervasive anti-intellectual culture) could conceive of a question like this > Why am I being forced to subsidize people that will just grow to resent…
Because taking geometry in 8th vs 9th vs 10th grade doesn’t really matter.
And given we are otherwise doing just fine, I think stagnation is far more likely to come from somewhere else.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#64Earlier quoted context omitted.
> school's curriculum is based on Russian teaching traditions that emphasize reasoning and deeper understanding early on, not just memorization and practice drills. "The child should be brought to abstract level as soon as possible," she says, "meaning early introduction of algebra and geometry, not only arithmetic," and helping children figure out principles for themselves rather than spoon-feeding them.
I buy into having a deeper understanding, and in both work and school, it's pretty clear who has a deeper understanding and who's going through the motions. That said, how is it that there's such range in pedagogy? So many people have studied teaching that you'd think we'd have a better idea of what works. Or maybe it's that goals are different.
I think a big part of this is society's expectations.
For example while there was bullying in my primary school - there was no bullying because you were good at math. The opposite was true - if you were bad at math it meant you're "dumb" and kids will laugh at you.
It wasn't all perfect - it was uncool to try hard (means you're dumb and have to work for it and that's boring) but it was very fashionable to instantly know every answer. So teachers had it much easier because kids had intrinsic motivation to learn math.
Another part of it was probably that the unemployment was at 20% at that point and everybody realized you have to be well educated to have a chance of good job.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#65My sister sent my niece to one, as even her 'private' middle school in Newton, MA, was just not strong enough. She did sign up my niece in every summer class she could, without overloading her. It was always my nieces' choice, and half the time she choose arts and half science. Now, my niece is able to do college entry level data science classes (she is about to become a Junior in HighSchool), and she actually likes…
Why is dumbing down science teaching the fault of extreme progressive left and not, say, reduced education funding, favouring religious teaching, or even more likely, nuanced policy difficulties that don't fit nicely into a left/right divide?
I don't think there's a single country that spends more on education than the US and yet here we are.
IMO the prosperity of the US has made people entitled and it's easier to complain than to put in the work.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
Do the students bring any motivation to the classroom? Like, is there a culture of "study hard and pay attention in maths and sciences, because that's how we escape poverty" or something like that? Here in New Zealand, middle class parents put a high premium on being happy and fulfilled, and most (that I've seen across several schools) don't really prime their kids for academic success by saying "this is important, w…
I grew up in Romania too (finished school in 1992), and at least during the communist regime I can't really remember a culture of studying hard to escape poverty, because that simply wasn't how you escaped poverty - it was more a mix of "choosing the right parents", the people you knew, a bit of luck, a bit of corruption and maybe some shrewdness, but Romania definitely wasn't a meritocracy at that time (that may how…
I finished highschool in 1999, grew up in a mono-industrial city which had just seen its only, well, industrial place in town close down and sold for scraps, in my case (and in the case of many of my colleagues) learning maths and getting into university with free admission was really one of the few escapes available from said town and, hence, from poverty.
I think those 7 years (1992 vs 1999) made a hell of a difference because of the economic "reforms" that were implemented in that time-interval and which actually saw many towns like the ones I grew up in become destitute in a matter of just a few years. Unfortunately that decade (the '90s) is not that well-studied yet in our history classes (maybe because it is too recent?), fact is I've only started to realise its true importance and its true, horrible economic and life-changing effects on our parents' generation (people who are now in the 60s and 70s) only recently. I think the same happened over almost all of the former Soviet Bloc, and imo it greatly explains some of the political tendencies we see today. But that is turning into OT, sorry for that.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#67Earlier quoted context omitted.
Since it was a communist country, everyone had the same conditions (crappy), and everyone had the same fricking clothes (only two clothing factories on the whole country), and same teachers (and no private schooling allowed), and we had the same books, and no calculators. And it is clear, if all conditions are equal, still people are not born equal. Some kids are just smarter than others, and some are just dummies, o…
Do you have data or anecdata on the effect of repeating an entire year? In many modern Western schools that'd be frowned upon as punitive and as likely to provoke a "well screw YOU!" response or ingrain "I must really be stupid" mindset.
I have seen less than 0.1% in my school fail like this. But yeah, it was punitive and usually did provoke a "well screw YOU!" response or ingrain "I must really be stupid" mindset.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#68Damn, need to reread Malushki i matematika.
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why is dumbing down science teaching the fault of extreme progressive left and not, say, reduced education funding, favouring religious teaching, or even more likely, nuanced policy difficulties that don't fit nicely into a left/right divide?
"reduced education funding" But Albania can finance rigorous teaching of science ... ? USA spends a lot more money per pupil than any former Eastern Bloc nation. But you can spend a lot of money on inefficient solutions. For a less politically charged example: compare expenses of the Falcon rocket family to those of the Space Launch System.
> But Albania can finance rigorous teaching of science
> USA spends a lot more money per pupil than any former Eastern Bloc nation. But you can spend a lot of money on inefficient solutions.
You're not wrong. Financialization of education continuing down from secondar to primary education, commodification of students—I think those are a bit better descriptions of the issue beyond "funding cuts" personally. Its incredibly easy to make things inefficient (or efficient at something else [0]) when quality/efficiency slowly fades from the conciousness of those in charge.
I'd say the more important thing is that there are large failures here, they were building before "Extreme progressive Liberals" (which depending on how I read that I can agree with, from the left even). Saying this as someone who was a STEM kid in high school, took AP Calc at 15, etc.—I'm more mixed on the more static curriculum as described earlier, its not as important here tho
[0] Like cranking out Amazon employees
https://www.jacobinmag.com/2021/07/amazon-warehouse-communit...>
"""
Writer Erika Hayasaki visited Cajon High. Here’s what she found:
A dozen students sat clustered at work tables inside an air-conditioned classroom, which was designed to emulate the inside of an Amazon facility. On one wall, Amazon’s giant logo grinned across a yellow and green banner. The words “CUSTOMER OBSESSION” and “DELIVER RESULTS” were painted against a corporate-style yellow backdrop. On a whiteboard, a teacher had written the words “Logistics Final Project,” and the lesson of the day was on Amazon’s “14 Leadership Principles.” Each teenager wore a company golf shirt emblazoned with the Amazon logo.
...
A public high-school classroom designed to resemble an Amazon facility, with students wearing Amazon logos on their clothing as they memorize Amazon’s leadership principles (which, it is worth noting, also include “Ownership” and “Think Big,” injunctions that hold merit for readers of this magazine when imagining how we might solve the problems exemplified by Amazon). Such a relationship between the company and public goods like a high school is part of what it means to consider Amazon as “the major working-class space of suburban and exurban socialization.”
"""
Re: American parents are sending their kids to 'Russian math' (2017)
#70By about 1/4th of the way through I wanted to just know what 'russian math' looked like. By Halfway it was pretty clear they weren't going to tell me. I skimmed the last half, nothing stood out. What does "Russian Math" look like?
> school's curriculum is based on Russian teaching traditions that emphasize reasoning and deeper understanding early on, not just memorization and practice drills. "The child should be brought to abstract level as soon as possible," she says, "meaning early introduction of algebra and geometry, not only arithmetic," and helping children figure out principles for themselves rather than spoon-feeding them.
I wish American teachers could teach the reasoning behind math.
I don't think most math teachers know themselfs though---even at some colleges.
I don't think I have even seen a math book that goes into depth on why a equation, or problem, is solved a certain way.
I would like to see most memorization in math, and most subjects nixed for good.
I have found, including myself, my early difficulties in math were due to just memorizing how to do a problem.
It wasen't until I started over (I went to a CC early. I hated high school socially, and it affected my studies. Going to a CC was the best move I made.)
I took basic math, and algebra, trig., at the community college.
It made inorganic chemistry, and physics, so easy.