Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading • Hacker News Board

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#61

Post by bdjddd77 » Sat, Aug 07, 2021, 8:54 PM UTC

dathinab wrote: post #10

baybal2 wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, a good time to say Bravo to their regulator then. Imagine if the regulator, and the state airline was ran by people half of whom shared the same surname, and it happened, say, in USA.

Except that imagine the issue is non-safety related and the regulator which happens to be related to the Airline company grounded them on requests of the Airline during low traffic times to put more pressure on the manufacturer and maybe profit from higher damage payments.... (Purely speculative to give a point for the next argument.) I.e. we can't say if the regulator acted correct with safety concern or corrupt unt…

I'd say this is correct. Qataris have one rule for them and another for everyone visiting or working ( the flippas, Nepalese etc), a friend is quite well connected as part of chemical supplies to oil industry, more like store at origin and broker nowadays, they live by different laws than the mere mortal (like me) passing through. You can live it large if you have the right connections - connection to above - one form of corruption doesn't exists it's systematic so yeah making the regulator act to protect a private contract condition is very plausible in qatar

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#62

Post by msandford » Sat, Aug 07, 2021, 10:07 PM UTC

philjohn wrote: post #60

himinlomax wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carbon fiber and other composites are actually much better wrt fatigue than aluminium. In fact they are pretty much immune to it, if you mean the word in the sense it's used in metallurgy. They are however much worse for impact resistance.

Which is why Aluminium drop-handlebars on bikes freak me out - when they fatigue they become brittle and can just snap one day if you put too much weight on them (e.g. out of the saddle sprinting).

The only time I've ever had aluminum drop bars go out on me was when the salt brine from sweat corroded the aluminum a lot.

I was on a hill in a mild rain riding next to a friend. I managed not to take her out and stay upright which was great. The cycling team I participated on in college said road bars need to have the tape off and inspected every year. They were right.

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#63

Post by mihaaly » Sat, Aug 07, 2021, 10:23 PM UTC

walrus01 wrote: post #27

EMM_386 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Keep in mind we have 30-year old A320s flying around using carbon-fiber, so we would seem to be out of the trial-period phase. This issue appears to be a cosmetic one with regards to the paint layers, not structural (see my other comment).

there are also a number of enthusiastic road cyclists riding 20, 25 year old carbon fiber frames - if not crashed or mechanically damaged (in a way that would also total beyond repair a thin walled aluminum frame like a cannondale CAAD8), they last quite a while.

The loads and operating conditions are quite different for bicycles and airplanes.

As I wouldn't use the characteristics of my steel coffemaker to predict the behaviour of an LNG vessel I wouldn't do the same with bicycles and airliners.

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#64

Post by NonEUCitizen » Sun, Aug 08, 2021, 12:41 AM UTC

danuker wrote: post #46

> Qatar Could it be the Qatar weather, typically over 40°C (100°F)? How much time do planes spend parked there? I would assume more, since the pandemic. Keeping them in the sun would make them even hotter than the air temperature (which is measured in the shade).

Even if so, for such an expensive product, the customer would expect it to withstand local weather conditions.

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#65

Post by Corinthian » Sun, Aug 08, 2021, 12:48 AM UTC

bdjddd77 wrote: post #61

dathinab wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that imagine the issue is non-safety related and the regulator which happens to be related to the Airline company grounded them on requests of the Airline during low traffic times to put more pressure on the manufacturer and maybe profit from higher damage payments.... (Purely speculative to give a point for the next argument.) I.e. we can't say if the regulator acted correct with safety concern or corrupt unt…

I'd say this is correct. Qataris have one rule for them and another for everyone visiting or working ( the flippas, Nepalese etc), a friend is quite well connected as part of chemical supplies to oil industry, more like store at origin and broker nowadays, they live by different laws than the mere mortal (like me) passing through. You can live it large if you have the right connections - connection to above - one for…

I live in Qatar, and the Qataris are notorious for finding ways to avoid paying their bills, delaying payment for extremely long periods, or asking for unreasonable reductions. Claiming something is wrong or faulty is a common tactic, another one is to substantially expand the scope of a project, and then refuse to pay when the project inevitably runs over the original deadline.

Akbar Al Baker pulled similar cons with the construction of Doha airport, demanding the project be accelerated but refusing to pay for the extra work that would be involved. Bechtel and Lindner/ Depa Interiors are two companies that spring to mind. They also suffered due to the erratic and insanely inefficient bureaucracy that is endemic in Qatar - 60-70% of Qataris "Work" in government jobs.

Similar stories can be heard of tower construction in Qatar. Empty and unfinished towers littler the country due the Qataris failing to pay their dues to construction companies. This article superficially covers it: https://www.constructionweekonline.com/business/article-3775...

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#66

Post by ezzaf » Sun, Aug 08, 2021, 2:53 AM UTC

systemvoltage wrote: post #51

EMM_386 wrote: post #5

This was first reported back in January when a Qatar Airways Airbus A350 was in Shannon for a repaint. When the paint was stripped they found surface coating irregularities. This is apparently cosmetic and not structural. This was one of the first A350s to be repainted. Qatar has 53 Airbus A350 aircraft, so why these particular 13 is the question now.

If it is cosmetic, that doesn't explain millions of dollars of loss from grounding the aircraft. Respectfully, this makes zero sense. Is there something more?

Are they losing money grounding them? They're probably operating fewer flights that pre covid so they could have more planes then needed and be using this opportunity to 'ground' planes with minor issues as a negotiation tactic to extract concessions from Airbus.

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#67

Post by bdjddd77 » Sun, Aug 08, 2021, 1:15 PM UTC

Corinthian wrote: post #65

bdjddd77 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd say this is correct. Qataris have one rule for them and another for everyone visiting or working ( the flippas, Nepalese etc), a friend is quite well connected as part of chemical supplies to oil industry, more like store at origin and broker nowadays, they live by different laws than the mere mortal (like me) passing through. You can live it large if you have the right connections - connection to above - one for…

I live in Qatar, and the Qataris are notorious for finding ways to avoid paying their bills, delaying payment for extremely long periods, or asking for unreasonable reductions. Claiming something is wrong or faulty is a common tactic, another one is to substantially expand the scope of a project, and then refuse to pay when the project inevitably runs over the original deadline. Akbar Al Baker pulled similar cons wit…

Will be interesting to see if the pill the world cup off next year with this style of bullshit.

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#68

Post by bdjddd77 » Sun, Aug 08, 2021, 2:47 PM UTC

bdjddd77 wrote: post #67

Corinthian wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Qatar, and the Qataris are notorious for finding ways to avoid paying their bills, delaying payment for extremely long periods, or asking for unreasonable reductions. Claiming something is wrong or faulty is a common tactic, another one is to substantially expand the scope of a project, and then refuse to pay when the project inevitably runs over the original deadline. Akbar Al Baker pulled similar cons wit…

Will be interesting to see if the pill the world cup off next year with this style of bullshit.

The pill -> they pull. Hard enough with alcohol in the shithole never mind pills ;)

Re: Qatar Airways grounds 13 Airbus A350s as fuselage degrading

#69

Post by Corinthian » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 12:28 AM UTC

bdjddd77 wrote: post #67

Corinthian wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I live in Qatar, and the Qataris are notorious for finding ways to avoid paying their bills, delaying payment for extremely long periods, or asking for unreasonable reductions. Claiming something is wrong or faulty is a common tactic, another one is to substantially expand the scope of a project, and then refuse to pay when the project inevitably runs over the original deadline. Akbar Al Baker pulled similar cons wit…

Will be interesting to see if the pill the world cup off next year with this style of bullshit.

You don't know the half of it. When they held the Asian cup, they were so concerned with the stadiums looking empty, they forced laborers to go and fill the seats. Problem is that many legitimate ticket holders were then denied entry! Of course people got angry about that, so the police saw fit to start administering beatings to people.

Now image that scenario with drunken football hooligans instead!