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Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

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Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#61

Post by sdgasg »

tyingq wrote: post #26
decebalus1 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As a manager, sometimes you need to say things like, "This bug needs to be fixed by EOD tomorrow" so that your team understands the urgency and your expectations. I'm sorry but you can do that without sounding both clueless and unreasonable. You can put everything else on hold, stop the line, explain why it's important for this to be fixed, etc.. to get the point across. "This bug needs to be fixed by EOD tomorrow"…

I agree, and I've been the manager in this situation. There's some reason he's saying "EOD tomorrow", so he should just share that. Like "It's likely we will lose this customer if this isn't fixed by EOD tomorrow...so please make this the only thing we're working until then".

Usually, you don't lose a customer over a bug in two days. Customers are reasonable usually and understand that it takes time to fix bugs. Most of other reasons like CEO doing a demo at a conference can also be managed. I really don't see a reason for hard deadlines ever. In fact, hard deadlines is sign of bad management with notable exception of startups and other young companies with no managers or new managers.

Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#62

Post by tyingq »

sdgasg wrote: post #61
tyingq wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, and I've been the manager in this situation. There's some reason he's saying "EOD tomorrow", so he should just share that. Like "It's likely we will lose this customer if this isn't fixed by EOD tomorrow...so please make this the only thing we're working until then".

Usually, you don't lose a customer over a bug in two days. Customers are reasonable usually and understand that it takes time to fix bugs. Most of other reasons like CEO doing a demo at a conference can also be managed. I really don't see a reason for hard deadlines ever. In fact, hard deadlines is sign of bad management with notable exception of startups and other young companies with no managers or new managers.

Sharing the reason allows for that debate, or alternatives. Maybe the customer has some sort of demo or something, and you could offer a workaround in that case.

Hard deadlines for some sort of fix or workaround do exist. Like "Earnings Call Tommorrow, and I can't just say ' I Dunno'"

Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#63

Post by hashkb »

Raidion wrote: post #51
analyst74 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious, does it actually lead to faster resolution or does it lead to engineers spending time thinking about how to deliver the bad news versus actually focusing on the problem?

Also manager. I feel like the manager's communication is off, though the end result is the same. All I need to ensure is that a) you are working on this HARD and know to turn down other tasks (and possibly put in extra hours) and b) you will update me immediately if the timeline can't be met. Usually this request, though frequently very rare takes the form of "Issue $ISSUE is causing critical impacts on $IMPORTANT_TH…

Wow if you're real, I'd love to have worked for you. Typically managers don't do the other half of what you do: they want critical surprise issue fixed yesterday, and with no caveats; you better still be available for marketing bullshit and that salesforce thing and that support issue we escalated to you and also when's that feature going to be ready?

Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#64

Post by hashkb »

davidhyde wrote: post #31

The best thing to do is to put yourself in the manager's shoes. 1. They probably know less about the issue than you do, including the fact that they don't know what you don't know. 2. The cannot fix the problem themselves; they have to find the best people to fix the problem. 3. They also have managers (or customers) harassing them for answers. They have two choices. The first is to get the issue fixed as quickly as…

It's never your job to empathize with your manager. They get paid more to manage you. If your manager needs coddling, you're managing them. Or you're being a friend; but as a subordinate they are responsible for enabling you, not the other way around.

When I'm a lead/mentor, I know my job is to protect and enable people. When I'm a cog in the machine, I expect leadership to have their shit together. When leadership doesn't have their shit together, I quit.

Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#65

Post by brokenmachine »

Raidion wrote: post #51
analyst74 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious, does it actually lead to faster resolution or does it lead to engineers spending time thinking about how to deliver the bad news versus actually focusing on the problem?

Also manager. I feel like the manager's communication is off, though the end result is the same. All I need to ensure is that a) you are working on this HARD and know to turn down other tasks (and possibly put in extra hours) and b) you will update me immediately if the timeline can't be met. Usually this request, though frequently very rare takes the form of "Issue $ISSUE is causing critical impacts on $IMPORTANT_TH…

>Usually this request, though frequently very rare

Spoken like a true manager

Re: Ask HN: How to deal with managers who set a hard time-limit on fixing a bug?

#67

Post by sdgasg »

tyingq wrote: post #62
sdgasg wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usually, you don't lose a customer over a bug in two days. Customers are reasonable usually and understand that it takes time to fix bugs. Most of other reasons like CEO doing a demo at a conference can also be managed. I really don't see a reason for hard deadlines ever. In fact, hard deadlines is sign of bad management with notable exception of startups and other young companies with no managers or new managers.

Sharing the reason allows for that debate, or alternatives. Maybe the customer has some sort of demo or something, and you could offer a workaround in that case. Hard deadlines for some sort of fix or workaround do exist. Like "Earnings Call Tommorrow, and I can't just say ' I Dunno'"

I agree with statement "Hard deadlines for some sort of fix or workaround do exist". Key being get this done before CEO's big presentation or hard code something or CEO doesn't demo this feature. The point is no one dies if CEO doesn't demo it or feature is not complete by earnings call. Earnings call is known event, one should have better planned for it.

And that bring me to people literally dying because of bugs in software like in cars or medical devices etc. That might be one time where I would have no problem sacrificing my family time for getting bug fixed. But most other situations are just artificial and deserve no extra stress.

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