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Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

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Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#61

Post by condomhacker »

foerbert wrote: post #20
barbacoa wrote: post #16

This is one of those rare times I agree with facebook. Why is this Facebook's problem? Sounds like Brazil should be enforcing their laws better. Facebook hosts for-sale postings, how reasonable is it for them to vet every post against scams and illegality?

If you follow this line of thought, the conclusion seems to be that if Facebook were to run ads for illegal drugs, explosives, or humans, it would simply be an indication that some country should be enforcing it's laws better. And Facebook would be totally in clear to continue showing those ads. This seems obviously wrong.

Why do you think it is wrong? If people use public forums to do illegal activities then it makes the job for law enforcement much easier.

Using the same logic of enforcing marketplace, there needs to be an observer for every private conversation on messenger so that no illegal pictures are sent.

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#62

Post by csomar »

jfoster wrote: post #40
MattGaiser wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the Brazilian government does not care, so they effectively own the land.

So what's actually being purchased in a transaction? Post-purchase, how is it any different than simply turning up & using the land?

These lands are usually owned by "agreement" within the "gangs" that are holding or controlling them. It happens a lot where I live until the government cracks down and everyone loses "his" land.

The reality is that they are doing temporary activity on the land (like raising cattle) and so if the government cracked down, they'll just take their cows and move on to the next land. The purchase price is too low and that makes it profitable.

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#66

Post by raister »

Brazilian here: the government will say in TV it's doing its best effort to protect the forest.

However, the president is appointing farmers and non-technical people all over those entities trying to protect the forest, and they are slowly giving rights, permits, etc. to deforestation.

And sadly, despite this being tracked and advertised by TV or other news entities, very little is done to deter these criminals all over the current administration.

MAYBE international lobbying could work with Brazil, as Germany threaten to reduce the money it gives to protect the forest in 2019 (I don't remember exactly when).

And let's not forget that the Amazon forest does not end in Brazilian borders - it goes on in many countries over there. People just assume it's a Brazilian problem (I know a large portion is located in Brazil's side), but it's more a 10-country problem, not to say, a humanity problem...

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#67

Post by madsbuch »

barbacoa wrote: post #16

This is one of those rare times I agree with facebook. Why is this Facebook's problem? Sounds like Brazil should be enforcing their laws better. Facebook hosts for-sale postings, how reasonable is it for them to vet every post against scams and illegality?

One way to enforce a law is by making a marketplace comply. This happens all sorts of places where transactions are made. Eg. you can not sell pizza in Denmark without having the proper training.

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#68

Post by [deleted] »

foerbert wrote: post #20
barbacoa wrote: post #16

This is one of those rare times I agree with facebook. Why is this Facebook's problem? Sounds like Brazil should be enforcing their laws better. Facebook hosts for-sale postings, how reasonable is it for them to vet every post against scams and illegality?

If you follow this line of thought, the conclusion seems to be that if Facebook were to run ads for illegal drugs, explosives, or humans, it would simply be an indication that some country should be enforcing it's laws better. And Facebook would be totally in clear to continue showing those ads. This seems obviously wrong.

[deleted]

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#69

Post by nindalf »

hetspookjee wrote: post #57
nindalf wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you verify proof of ownership? I have a “patta” indicating I own some land. There are only a few million people in the world who can even read the words on this document. There are only a few thousand who can understand the meaning behind those words. There are many a hundred who can verify if it’s a forgery or not. Meanwhile I doubt you can tell which part of the world it’s from based on just “patta” or looki…

I see I'm in the wrong on the obviousness of the ownership of the land. I wish I had a good way to verify such things. But I don't and I am getting that no one really has. So, because it's so hard to verify, does that than mean that it's ok to sell? Given that Brazil doesn't have a clear way of proving ownership, and people are abusing this situation and, and Facebook is making a profit of this abuse, while it's clea…

They don't have a way of verifying ownership of any other item on the marketplace either. That tablet I have for sale - did I steal it? Maybe. A thief can easily supply a forged receipt. An honest person who bought if for real might have lost their receipt. It's an intractable problem. It's not possible to verify ownership of every item there is. Should online marketplaces simply shut down then? If they are, people will get around it by making buying-selling groups. It is difficult to police behaviour that is, strictly speaking, legal.

If your suggestion was to shut down land sales in Brazil in particular because of the evident failures of the Brazilian government, yeah seems reasonable. Not like it will stop these criminals, but it's a worthwhile step to take.

You mentioned profit a couple of times. How much profit do you think the marketplace made in this case? My understanding is that listings are free.

Re: Amazon rainforest plots sold via Facebook Marketplace ads

#70

Post by matheusmoreira »

barbacoa wrote: post #16

This is one of those rare times I agree with facebook. Why is this Facebook's problem? Sounds like Brazil should be enforcing their laws better. Facebook hosts for-sale postings, how reasonable is it for them to vet every post against scams and illegality?

> how reasonable is it for them to vet every post against scams and illegality?

You gotta be kidding me. Facebook is a multi-billion dollar corporation. Just make them do it. Their legal departments will figure it out. They'll probably do it even faster than the brazilian authorities too. Google once fed brazilian judges this exact same excuse after being ordered to take down content. They got told to figure out a way to comply since surely Google has the capability to do it. As far as I know, they did.

How many problems would be fixed if we stopped feeling sorry for the rich corporations and started requiring them to assume responsibility for the messes they create?

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