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Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

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61–70 of 198 posts

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, you do give them their name, that's a strong indication of race and gender for most people, isn't it?

Sure, my name is unisex though. Race might be obtained, but honestly even that is questionable

> Race might be obtained, but honestly even that is questionable

If you mean "irrevocably determined with a 100% certainty" maybe...

But you know, most people who think their name doesn't give away their race, are a certain race...

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Funny that this is really such an uncomfortable truth for some people here... I'm a black guy with a Ghanaian name, so I laughed out loud reading the comment.

It's not like black people aren't allowed to have "euro-centric" names, but, surprise surprise, Caucasians represent a large majority of people with those names

Likewise there are names that almost no Caucasians have (like mine)

If someone is reading your resume intent on being biased, a name like "Austin Walters" is going to appear as... a white guy.

There black guys named Austin Walters but they're also not conducting a census... if someone really wants to discriminate against you based on race, your name is plenty to go on.

https://www.mynamestats.com/First-Names/A/AU/AUSTIN/chart-di...

https://www.mynamestats.com/Last-Names/W/WA/WALTERS/chart-di...

Again, they're not conducting a science study, an 80% chance is plenty for the kind of person trying to discriminate...

Likewise, someone who reads my name, which uses consonants in a way that English doesn't usually ( causing people to mispronounce my very simple last name even when reading it verbatim) will instantly assume I'm black.

It's something I accept as a person with a very black name, it tells you the main audience of HN is this is really such a revelation for some of you lol

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#62

And once again a race study that doesn't list Native Americans at all. It would be nice if they remembered 2% of the US population, since certain policies ("Actual Name") have discriminated against Native Americans because of the ignorance of silicon valley firms. AIHEC and American Indian College Fund (collegefund.org) could really use the help to get placements for students.

They don't care about you because you're not a politically influential demographic. Notice how the demographic that dominates this debate is the second most privileged and influential demographic in the country: white women; yet they are portrayed as being some powerless minority.

It's always powerful demographics fighting each other. Nobody cares about the actual minorities that have no representation. That is almost tautological.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#63
post #16

There's a fascinating study on orchestra auditions, where it was found that performing blind auditions (where the interviewee's identity is hidden to the interviewer) led to more equitable gender representation: https://gap.hks.harvard.edu/orchestrating-impartiality-impac... IMHO, if the tech industry wants to live up to its narrative of meritocracy, this is one obvious improvement over existing processes. No, it won…

We talk a big game about merit, capability, qualifications and such.

Ultimately though, nearly all actual selection processes are are subjective or ilegible... depending on how you see these things. How an interviewer feels about you intuitively matters a lot, maybe the most. Actual tests of skill are usually intuitive as well. An interviewer tries to gauge your skills, but it's rarely designed to be an objective test of skill. If it is an objective test of skill, it's rarely the primary decision driver.

Blind auditions enforce a certain kind of objectivity. But, I think we can read into the fact that musicians "audition" while employees "interview." You perform an audition.

Blind auditions would be a radical change to hiring/selection. The big advantages/disadvantages of the approach are like those of standardised testing. They measure the easily measurable, and bury everything else.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#64
post #16

There's a fascinating study on orchestra auditions, where it was found that performing blind auditions (where the interviewee's identity is hidden to the interviewer) led to more equitable gender representation: https://gap.hks.harvard.edu/orchestrating-impartiality-impac... IMHO, if the tech industry wants to live up to its narrative of meritocracy, this is one obvious improvement over existing processes. No, it won…

Here's an article detailing an experiment with voice gender changers in online interviews:

https://blog.interviewing.io/we-built-voice-modulation-to-ma...

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if they don't capitalize "white", because that's what white supremacists do, what does that say about capitalizing "black"? A good number of the people pushing the "Black" spelling are openly Afrocentric, or profess to be.

I dunno man, are black people systemically killing other ethnic groups in America right now? Do they have a history of genocide and slavery on the scale of white people? Do we see a bunch of black people doing the black equivalent of Nazi salutes on the side of the road around the country?

Taking any demographic and extrapolating the actions of a few to the whole, then basing policies around that is "systemic racism". But not if you're white. News flash, you're not looking for equality with that mindset.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So if they don't capitalize "white", because that's what white supremacists do, what does that say about capitalizing "black"? A good number of the people pushing the "Black" spelling are openly Afrocentric, or profess to be.

I dunno man, are black people systemically killing other ethnic groups in America right now? Do they have a history of genocide and slavery on the scale of white people? Do we see a bunch of black people doing the black equivalent of Nazi salutes on the side of the road around the country?

Is there any group that is "systemically killing" any other group in America right now? Please bring data.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#67
Okay, honest question coming from ignorance. In computing at least, there's a well known diversity disparity going back to STEM graduation rates.

It seems financial is a similar boat: Wells Fargo recently claimed a “limited talent pool" but got criticized by AOC for lacking "talent to recruit Black workers".

Obviously society, including industry, could do more to get kids into school. But right now, in the resume pile, what should employers be doing, and why is "not enough X talent" not a good defense?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/09/23/wells-far...

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#68
Personal anecdote:

I knew someone who worked as a recruiter at Boeing a few years ago, and she told me the pressure from higher ups to give preferential treatment to female applicants was crazy. She said they couldn't explicitly discriminate, but would use things like "Women in Tech" events to try to increase their female applicant pool.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#69
Searched the article for "visa" and "migrant" found no results, surely that hugely skews the data with respect to Asians?

I fully imagine there is bias towards Asians within SV but it'd be heavily weighted towards recent arrivals who either have uncertain visa status or aren't yet at native speaking English proficiency surely? Whereas you'd have to imagine the vast majority of black applicants meet both of those requirements with ease.

Re: Gender and Race Preferences in Hiring at Silicon Valley Tech Firms [pdf]

#70
post #16

There's a fascinating study on orchestra auditions, where it was found that performing blind auditions (where the interviewee's identity is hidden to the interviewer) led to more equitable gender representation: https://gap.hks.harvard.edu/orchestrating-impartiality-impac... IMHO, if the tech industry wants to live up to its narrative of meritocracy, this is one obvious improvement over existing processes. No, it won…

Get on with the times friend, we need to eliminate blind auditions now.They discriminate:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/16/arts/music/blind-audition...

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