Can someone add IN MICE to the title?
This needs to happen consistently with paper titles. There's a Twitter account is dedicated to it:
Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
61–70 of 123 posts
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
A mouse starves to death in 48 hours. I have gone 12 days without food (water fast) and was not even close to starvation. Probably could have gone another few weeks before I expired. I would say 16 hours for a mouse is probably more like 7 plus days without food for a Human.
I hope you don't mind me asking but why did you fast for 12 days?
I started experimenting with fasting a about 2-3 years ago. My initial goal was weight loss (lost 100lbs from 272->172). My limit was typically 7 days but I wanted to see what the impact of a longer fast would do in the area of autophagy. I experienced some positive results but would discourage others from doing it, 3-5 days is more than enough. I would also discourage doing alternate day fasting or 24 hour fasting since it will screw up your metabolism (I ate 2 meals (2500kcal) every other day for 3 months) and found it very stressful on my general well being and metabolism.
These days I maintain 172 lbs with time delayed eating (18/6) and a clean diet.
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#63Every time I see a research being published on HN, it ends up being a mouse model. Is there a place on the internet where I can see a list of publications describing the final (or close to final) stage of a research made on humans? Mouse model researches worsen my overall abstraction of where the humanity, in a scientific sense, is.
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#64Interesting and lines up with other brain development factors found in human fasting ( https://cdnsciencepub.com/doi/abs/10.1139/apnm-2014-0290 ). I often read these threads about fasting/intermittent fasting on HN and see a lot of nitpicking about flaws in the study. Given that almost all studies tend to fall between "no effect" or "clear positive effect" of fasting on health, do we have enough evidence to say "fast…
My opinion: I think it's a qualified "yes."
If you can successfully pull it off, there's substantial evidence it is generally beneficial. But I have a genetic disorder that impairs fat processing (so I had no real fat stores to draw on while fasting) and I began fasting or semi fasting while homeless at times when I was too broke to afford food.
Initially, it was extremely hard on me. I routinely threw up on fasting days and usually managed to get something into me so was really only light rationed, not actually fasting. It took years for me to get well enough for fasting to stop being horrible torturous drama and I still have extremely severe diarrhea when I resume eating.
Second, there is a thing called Refeeding Syndrome that can occur when you break a fast. It can be deadly.
I think it benefits a lot of conditions, but if you have a condition, it's also potentially dangerous to try it and we need to get a lot more savvy about how people with conditions can safely try it.
With asking around about Refeeding Syndrome and some best practices for how to effectively break a fast plus some experience, breaking a fast has gotten to be a lot easier on me.
I could have potentially died from fasting and it likely wouldn't have been blamed on fasting. My condition is serious enough they would have blamed my condition.
But it has proven beneficial and I hate it less than I used to.
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
From the fine article: >We evaluated the impact of 3 months of IF (12, 16, and 24 hr of food deprivation on a daily basis)
Super interested in how the mice who experienced daily 24 hr food deprivation for 3 months did in the study.
actually there are studies especially from David Sinclair that shows that fasting and calorie restrictions help mice live longer and healthier.
For those interested here is a great interview with David Sinclair, Harvard Researcher on aging:
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
That’s what I did for a long time. But somehow it didn’t feel right. I then switched to 4pm to 8am. Works way better for me now
So early dinner? And then a big breakfast? It’s hard with a family though if they’re on different schedules.
> It’s hard with a family though if they’re on different schedules.
My approach was that the kids ate things I wouldn’t and so it wasn’t difficult for me to be present and not eat.
And pedagogically it was apparently better than eating, say, just salad or a minuscule serving of the meal, as their mother was concerned about modeling behavior that might encourage diet pathologies (e.g. anorexia).
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#67Earlier quoted context omitted.
Fun fact: Mice can only survive 48 hours without food, so not eating for 24 hours is quite long for them.
What determines how long you can survive without food? The speed of your metabolism?
Mostly how much fat and muscle tissue one has. The known record under medical supervision is over a year, but that person was very fat at the start.
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#68Diet restriction (with maintaining the required nutrients) is also key to living longer
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#69Most people (especially those who have built up some "reserves") can survive for a long time without food and would safely last months on just liquid. (treated water or herbal tea + some vitamins & minerals).
I did a water only fast which is documented here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16533514
The mental benefits in terms of ability to concentrate are hard to put into words. It's different than with micro-dosing which gives you a false sense of your abilities. The long fast showed me what kind of energy gets unlocked when we feel like we're close to snuffing it. It's like the body gets ready for a final push so that you can hunt and find food. I stopped doing these crazy type of diets after discovering IF.
IF gives me a similar result (the highs and lows on the graph are less extreme but at least it's sustainable) without landing myself in hospital (in retrospect the kidney stones were most likely legacy/cruft that needed to be refactored anyway, and who knows what kind of cancers or other long term illnesses my body "ate" while I pushed him that hard). I understand this is all pretty mental to read but back in 2013 there was no IF and all I had was the theory that dogs and rats that were kept on an IF survived longer.
!!!
Disclaimer: this is the most extreme one I ever done so please don't start out with this if you want to try... try 7 days or 2 weeks are enough time to do some extreme diet. But don't go overboard - which is way too easy after 2 weeks because you'll be so high on your own achievement and you won't feel hunger. It'll feel like you're able to continue for 2 or 3 months. (you won't). the key is in recognizing this and to quit regardless! Also knowing your own body is key. E.g. if you do sports and have a 20 year history of pushing yourself to extremes probably yes. But I understand why doctors bail and give the "blanket advise" that this is irresponsible.
!!!
Re: Intermittent fasting increases hippocampal neurogenesis in mice
#70Can someone add IN MICE to the title?
Yes. Added.