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We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

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Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#61

Post by throwaway0a5e »

joosters wrote: post #24
bipson wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that's not what "at your own risk" means. "At your own risk" means you bear the risk (legally). If something happens, it is on you, and the manufacturer offloads any liability on you. That does not imply what the risks are. Life threatening? You are risking other people's lives.

No need to be pedantic. No-one's arguing about the meaning of 'at your own risk', it's just that your decision to use this software affects more than just yourself.

To be fair the person they're replying to was the one who was either being pedantic of trying to score some cheap virtue points by stating the obvious (and I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt and assuming the former)

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#62

Post by DoingIsLearning »

kitd wrote: post #59
DoingIsLearning wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 1. Speed limit for the area/road I am in. That one already exists, many manufacturers already provide 'intelligent speed' systems, which combine gps and traffic sign recognition camera info to determine the current speed limit in that stretch of road and display it on your dashboard.

Most satnavs have it already.

Partially...

- Satnav, is based on GPS which has a degree of error, it might place on a 4 lane road or a 2 lane road immediately parallel to it, with a drastically different speed limit.

- Satnav has no way of adapting to temporary lane closures or roadwork speed limits.

That's the reasoning for combining GPS with TSR camera data, in these 'intelligent speed' ADAS systems.

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#63

Post by WrtCdEvrydy »

bipson wrote: post #21
kriro wrote: post #5

Very nicely executed device with a good price point. Of course it's an utter nightmare with regards to privacy and I'd be very nervous regarding security and safety when I'd hand over the controls of my car to basically an android phone. Maybe I skimmed over it but I'd be interested in knowing which phones they use exactly. So I applaud the engineering but it's not a device I'd buy (and yes I do own and carry around…

My main concern would be that the architecture of an OTS Android system does not offer any guarantees regarding real-time i.e. hard deadlines. Ever had an android app or even the whole phone locking up? Even if it is only for a second or two, I don't want this to happen to a device that feeds live data into my car's controller. Even if this is only level 2 driver assist. If a car would get a bogus "you are crossing a…

AutoPilot disengages if you try to take over the wheel, it's one of the basic features that is available.

The only instance where you are steering is on the new lane switch (turn on blinker, check lane, depart from current lane)

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#64

Post by jimmyjack »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #57
jimmyjack wrote: post #47

I want a device that will not control the car but will give more a ton of real-time information, ideally projected on some corner of my windshield. Information including: 1. Speed limit for the area/road I am in. 2. Real time radar report telling me how many cars/pedestrians e.t.c are around me. 3. Information on common accident types in the area I am driving in. 4. For my corner of the world, it will be good to get…

> 1. Speed limit for the area/road I am in. That one already exists, many manufacturers already provide 'intelligent speed' systems, which combine gps and traffic sign recognition camera info to determine the current speed limit in that stretch of road and display it on your dashboard.

Yeah I think Satnav answers most. I guess the biggest thing we are missing is Lidar hooked to Satnav

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#65

Post by Spare_account »

DoingIsLearning wrote: post #62
kitd wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most satnavs have it already.

Partially... - Satnav, is based on GPS which has a degree of error, it might place on a 4 lane road or a 2 lane road immediately parallel to it, with a drastically different speed limit. - Satnav has no way of adapting to temporary lane closures or roadwork speed limits. That's the reasoning for combining GPS with TSR camera data, in these 'intelligent speed' ADAS systems.

Satnav has no way of adapting to temporary lane closures or roadwork speed limits.

Waze is pretty good at this, presumably because the road/map data is crowdsourced

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#67

Post by agumonkey »

jimmyjack wrote: post #47

I want a device that will not control the car but will give more a ton of real-time information, ideally projected on some corner of my windshield. Information including: 1. Speed limit for the area/road I am in. 2. Real time radar report telling me how many cars/pedestrians e.t.c are around me. 3. Information on common accident types in the area I am driving in. 4. For my corner of the world, it will be good to get…

sligthly similar in spirit.. I so wish I could have local information about stop lights..

I like to play the 'continuous driving' game where I coast in neutral if the next light is red and try to get the green light so save kinetic energy etc

With this data I could compute the avg speed required to do so (granted there are other factors because I don't want to clog the traffic too etc etc)

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#68

Post by marc__1 »

nojvek wrote: post #49

I am willing to bet that the nimble AutoPilot selling Waymo and Tesla have some hope. Cruise and Zoox are burning VC money like crazy with little to show.

> Waymo and Tesla have some hope. Cruise and Zoox are burning VC money like crazy with little to show.

The numbers for Cruise reported by GM [1]:

As of six months Q22020, Cruise posted revenues of $53m and total expenses of $498m, compared to $50m in rev and $553m in expenses for the same six month period in 2019.

Total cash in hand for Cruise is $2.2b with zero debt

2 more years of cash burn is not your typical startup that is 'burning VC money like crazy', but still the cash burn is large.

Now the question is if Cruise can expect any revenue from the new DMV authorization in SF [2]

[1] starts page 9 https://media.gm.com/content/dam/Media/gmcom/investor/2020/j...

[2] https://www.dmv.ca.gov/portal/news-and-media/dmv-authorizes-...

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#69

Post by ezconnect »

saddlerustle wrote: post #44
ezconnect wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CAN bus is the standard physical interface. What is not standard is the message being passed, so each car will have it's own message for car information. What surprised me about OpenPilot is how some of the electric steering system can be tricked into turning using false sensor data. It's actually amazing that almost all cars now can be driven by software the only thing missing are more accurate and complicated senso…

OpenPilot doesn't "trick" the steering system using "false sensor data". The steering controller just accepts messages for commanding steering over CAN bus. The same messages are used by the stock ADAS system. Also, this bus is not usually exposed to the OBD port, so OpenPilot just connects to the same port the stock ADAS ECU uses.

OpenPilot pretends it's the ADAS and some cars you can pass the torque sensor on the custom serial bus used by the cars. There's not much difference in tricking or pretending or overwhelming the serial bus with another data message to make the steering system respond to OpenPilot.

Re: We Tested Comma AI's OpenPilot

#70

Post by ezconnect »

bipson wrote: post #19
ezconnect wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CAN bus is the standard physical interface. What is not standard is the message being passed, so each car will have it's own message for car information. What surprised me about OpenPilot is how some of the electric steering system can be tricked into turning using false sensor data. It's actually amazing that almost all cars now can be driven by software the only thing missing are more accurate and complicated senso…

It is actually concerning that you can inject false sensor data this easily. I mean, sure, the messages on the CAN will not be encrypted or signed in any way, I know, but still...

It's not yet concerning since you need to hardwire to the custom serial bus of modern car to have access to steering and cruise control systems. What's concerning is the trend started by Tesla that remotely disables your car.
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