Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses • Hacker News Board

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#61

Post by jasperry » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:14 PM UTC

scotty79 wrote: post #9

java-man wrote: post #2

It is a fun read. But what we really need (to convert this to science) is to measure the objective metrics. For example, measure the number of articles in [insert social network name] for claims that contradict established scientific laws (let's say, physics). I know it'll be more difficult to do for economy or sociology, but at least with physics we might have a large body of well established and experimentally conf…

I've seen comparisons of how popular songs nowadays use simpler and less diverse words than they used to.

One explanation I've recently heard for this is that, since there are now so many sources of information competing for our attention, only the most blatant and simplistic attention-grabbing music gets noticed and thus becomes popular.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#62

Post by seanalltogether » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:14 PM UTC

TallGuyShort wrote: post #32

I've engaged a few flat earthers to actually listen to their arguments and show them my own evidence that it's real (locating amateur radio satellites using data shared by people around the globe and demonstrating the doppler effect on them). The response strikes me as being indicative of mental illness. And I don't mean that as an insult - I mean that when confronted with that they're clearly irrational. And somethi…

I would not be surprised to learn that flat earth theories started as satire online, but it slowly turned into a theory for people who didn't know any better. I would also not be surprised to learn that QANON simply started out as trolling and morphed into the weird following it now has.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#63

Post by ben_w » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:14 PM UTC

the_gastropod wrote: post #10

I've thought a bit about the "It’s real, and it’s probably all that extra CO2 in the atmosphere" option a bit, myself. It seems to be a worldwide phenomenon, with IQ's dropping [1] for the past few decades, and seemingly a bit of a resurgence in fascistic world leaders. I know increased CO2 does have a negative impact on cognitive ability—but I'm not sure what levels yield a meaningful effect. Regardless, no harm in…

From what I’ve seen/read, levels inside closed offices could plausibly have a significant effect.

The good news is the global CO2 levels probably aren’t high enough to be a severe problem yet (but it might still show up in the stats); the bad news is there is enough unburdened fossil fuel in the ground to make it into a big problem.

https://www.advancedsciencenews.com/co2-on-the-brain-and-the...

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#64

Post by hsod » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:14 PM UTC

I have a different theory. I think in a world of mass communication and social media there are a large number of people who feel grey, flat, anonymous, just another face in the crowd. They want to stand out. Being right isn't as important as being interesting.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#65

Post by cblconfederate » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:14 PM UTC

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #33

Counterintuitively, people love reading about and engaging in what they consider "stupidity". Internet companies capitalize on this by bringing an optimized stream of stupidity for your viewing pleasure. Take a look at the front page of Reddit (logged out, default subs): Half of the content highlights stupidity of others: /r/IdiotsInCars shows the worst drivers from around the world, /r/insanepeoplefacebook shows the…

Anything out of the ordinary is eyecatching. Human (and mouse) brains are overactive in novelty, it s well established

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#66

Post by tunnuz » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:15 PM UTC

TallGuyShort wrote: post #32

I've engaged a few flat earthers to actually listen to their arguments and show them my own evidence that it's real (locating amateur radio satellites using data shared by people around the globe and demonstrating the doppler effect on them). The response strikes me as being indicative of mental illness. And I don't mean that as an insult - I mean that when confronted with that they're clearly irrational. And somethi…

Also vanity. There is something really comforting into thinking that YOU have it all figured out and know the truth and you’re smarter than everyone else around you. And if someone proves you wrong, well then you have to face the hard reality that maybe you’re not that smart. And that’s hard to accept.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#67

Post by TallGuyShort » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:15 PM UTC

rocqua wrote: post #52

TallGuyShort wrote: post #32

I've engaged a few flat earthers to actually listen to their arguments and show them my own evidence that it's real (locating amateur radio satellites using data shared by people around the globe and demonstrating the doppler effect on them). The response strikes me as being indicative of mental illness. And I don't mean that as an insult - I mean that when confronted with that they're clearly irrational. And somethi…

I don't think that acting weirdly when confronted with your own irrationality is a sign of mental illness. Accepting that you were wrong is generally a hard thing. Admitting to someone else that you were wrong is similarly hard. If you get totally and irrefutably proven wrong by someone you are having a heated argument with, that is doubly hard. In order to respond correctly you need to, within a very short time-span…

Yeah I could understand that. Depending on the forum though, I seem to see people have the same conversation repeatedly, like they're just as confident as they were before. Vicious cycle if that is what's happening - that they believe what they believed harder because it didn't feel good to feel wrong.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#68

Post by puranjay » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:15 PM UTC

I haven't managed to read a book in two years now. I spend all my free time on this rectangular glass hellhole. And I seem to have given up on rational analysis and stupidly jump into the trenches to argue with people I know are incredibly wrong.

So I can at least say that I'm getting dumber.

But if I had to comment on the original article, I'd go with option B, no. 9. The internet has truly made stupidity more accessible and permanent.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#69

Post by robocat » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:15 PM UTC

scotty79 wrote: post #9

java-man wrote: post #2

It is a fun read. But what we really need (to convert this to science) is to measure the objective metrics. For example, measure the number of articles in [insert social network name] for claims that contradict established scientific laws (let's say, physics). I know it'll be more difficult to do for economy or sociology, but at least with physics we might have a large body of well established and experimentally conf…

I've seen comparisons of how popular songs nowadays use simpler and less diverse words than they used to.

That could easily be explained in other ways: fashion, reach, global market, simplicity and clarity, anti-intellectualism, LCD.

Re: Is Stupidity Expanding? Some Hypotheses

#70

Post by Der_Einzige » Thu, Oct 15, 2020, 9:16 PM UTC

nemo44x wrote: post #39

"There is no truth, only power. What I’ve been interpreting as truth and rationality has been my own attempt to align my thinking with the political clique that was in power when I was being educated. What I’m interpreting as rising stupidity has been the collapse in power and status of that clique and the political obsolescence of the variety of “truth” and “rationality” I internalized as a child. Those pomo philoso…

A rejection of truth doesn't necessarily imply that scientific-liberalism is bad. I don't think that the post-modernists should be held responsible for encouraging anti-scientific thinking - of course unless your version of science is that science and rationality give us absolute truths of the world.

Science can have lots of utility and not find us truth at all.

It's a fault of some post modernists for not saying this part out loud as much as they should, and maybe a small handful are the rabid radicals who reject the scientific method as not having any utility, but I don't think that the majority of left-wing post modernists are anti-science per say. I think that they want science to be more narrowly defined and to have a broader understanding of the socio-political ramification of its approaches.