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2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

nytimes.com

61–70 of 74 posts

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#61

It is distinctly unhelpful to keep trying to make people feel bad. People experiencing negative emotions are less capable of effecting positive outcomes. It is also unhelpful to keep referring to individual points like this as illustrative. It's hypocritical and provides ammunition to climate change deniers when they say things like "But this spring was really cold!" Weather is not climate and a year over year compar…

What do you suggest as an alternative? Let's say we stop publishing true facts like this, in order to maintain some sort of message control. What do you propose that message actually be?

I've looked a few times, but I have been unable to find a table of global average temperatures by month for the past few decades. The only "true facts" that newspapers publish are those that are cherry-picked.

I, personally, accept climate change on faith because I defer to the experts. However, it's shocking to me how inaccessible unbiased facts are. It is conceivable that record cold temps are being set just as often. It's conceivable that nearly everything is a record if global averages are just now being recorded by month (or if they have been rebaselined after a methodology change).

Articles like this raise more questions than they answer. They aren't going to convince someone who isn't already convinced, and they only demoralize those who already are convinced.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#62

It is distinctly unhelpful to keep trying to make people feel bad. People experiencing negative emotions are less capable of effecting positive outcomes. It is also unhelpful to keep referring to individual points like this as illustrative. It's hypocritical and provides ammunition to climate change deniers when they say things like "But this spring was really cold!" Weather is not climate and a year over year compar…

Everyone should agree with the first point that it's unhelpful to try to make people feel bad, but I don't think that is what's happening here. Healthy people, almost by definition, should be able to look at all the major headlines in the world without getting emotional and going into a spiral of depression. We both probably have parents/friends with unhealthy emotional processing habits, but we shouldn't accept our distorted reality on how normal, healthy people emotionally process news.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you suggest as an alternative? Let's say we stop publishing true facts like this, in order to maintain some sort of message control. What do you propose that message actually be?

I've looked a few times, but I have been unable to find a table of global average temperatures by month for the past few decades. The only "true facts" that newspapers publish are those that are cherry-picked. I, personally, accept climate change on faith because I defer to the experts. However, it's shocking to me how inaccessible unbiased facts are. It is conceivable that record cold temps are being set just as oft…

I believe that being exposed to the same piece of information repeatedly causes us humans to believe it is true, whether it's true or not. So the evidence suggests that articles like this actually are helpful, since there are only so many times you can read that this is the warmest [month] on record before you start to believe that things probably are getting warmer overall.

But as to what you were seeking, here were my first DDG results:

https://www.climate.gov/news-features/understanding-climate/...

https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/global-temperature/

I think newspapers publish things that are news, which means it's something that happens at a given point in time. A monthly number is news, while "the past few decades" is not. An organization putting out a press release is news, so if that mentions a long-term trend, that can become news, but if it hasn't changed in any detail since the last report, then it's not really news either.

Newspapers, and news sources in generally, are really bad at communicating long-term trends like global climate change, unfortunately.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#64

It is distinctly unhelpful to keep trying to make people feel bad. People experiencing negative emotions are less capable of effecting positive outcomes. It is also unhelpful to keep referring to individual points like this as illustrative. It's hypocritical and provides ammunition to climate change deniers when they say things like "But this spring was really cold!" Weather is not climate and a year over year compar…

In any important social movement, there is a large amount of people who will do nothing, there is a smaller amount of people that would provide support, and there is a much smaller group who will do the majority of the work.

The "make people feel bad" will only affect the large amount of people who wouldn't do anything anyway and who wouldn't be convinced to do anything until there is much larger social pressure.

These kinds of articles might actually inspire that smaller group do do more because it's so so bad. The data is REALLY bad. That small group will create a larger group who would provide support (financial, etc). Once a critical mass is hit, the larger group who was turned away because of bad feelings will come around.

It's more important to focus on the people who would actually do something and who would provide support. These articles and stories don't turn away the people doing all the work, it actually inspires them more.

For example, I am one of those people and this article makes me want to do more and puts more urgency into it.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#65
post #10

It is distinctly unhelpful to keep trying to make people feel bad. People experiencing negative emotions are less capable of effecting positive outcomes. It is also unhelpful to keep referring to individual points like this as illustrative. It's hypocritical and provides ammunition to climate change deniers when they say things like "But this spring was really cold!" Weather is not climate and a year over year compar…

a year over year comparison of one calendar month is not a trend I'm in my 40s and I've been seeing headlines like "hottest September on record" since my twenties. This is just the most recent one.

[deleted]

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#66

Is this not anxiety inducing for anyone else? Is that why I see these posts fall away quickly, or is news like this just expected now, and so not that interesting?

I have had enough life experience to know that so much is beyond our control. We could die of a car accident tomorrow. Cancer could strike us down within the next six months. We know the problem here. We have some solutions. We just need to act!

Yes! You could die in a car accident tomorrow, you can also ask the car companies to make safer cars. You could die of cancer within the next six months, and you can also ask the medical companies to make drugs to fight cancer.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#67

Is this not anxiety inducing for anyone else? Is that why I see these posts fall away quickly, or is news like this just expected now, and so not that interesting?

Here’s my issue. What amount of carbon cutting would satisfy you? If we cut by 50% and the temperature is still rising year over year do we need to cut more? How far do you want to go and how much needs to be risked Before you’re satisfied that our carbon levels are acceptable. Sorry that you feel the world isn’t following your desires and expectations but they need more than a promise that things may get better to e…

I believe at this point it's negative, negative carbon. We are at the point where we have to start taking carbon out of the air soon. It's also not about satisfying "us" whoever "us" is. It's about preventing collapse of all life on earth including ours.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#68
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here’s my issue. What amount of carbon cutting would satisfy you? If we cut by 50% and the temperature is still rising year over year do we need to cut more? How far do you want to go and how much needs to be risked Before you’re satisfied that our carbon levels are acceptable. Sorry that you feel the world isn’t following your desires and expectations but they need more than a promise that things may get better to e…

So, being genuine here. I don't care about carbon fuel, in the sense I have no particular attachment to it. In every case where I've replaced carbon with something else, it's turned out to be preferable. Cleaner, quieter, lighter, longer lasting. To me, there are lots of other reasons for cutting carbon than the environment. The environment is just a big plus. If we cut all carbon fuel and ended up with longer lastin…

Markets won't fix this. The scale of the problem has no market solution.

Re: 2020 Had the Warmest September on Record, Data Shows

#69
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you have expected Covid to have any effect on the current climate? Even the most short-lived greenhouse gas (methyl bromide) has a lifetime of 0.7 years, so any changes in emissions would not show up until now. And its relevance today is next to zero, since it's been banned along with many CFCs since the Montreal Protocol. The relevant greenhouse gases have lifetimes of years to decades.

My point is that even if we were able to drastically cut emissions (which is the current campaigning goal) we actually need to think a step further ahead than that, as in okay, we cut emissions, what now? I have been reading the news on this climate chaos for decades so I am not naive enough to think that the planet will be magically restored to perfect tranquillity the minute the last burger eating SUV driver throws…

I think you overestimate the effect of Covid on carbon emissions. By a lot.
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