61–70 of 288 posts
"Way of life"? Way to trivialize their loss of freedom and autonomy and habeas corpus .
The exact wording is "The socialist system and policies shall not be practised in the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region, and the previous capitalist system and way of life shall remain unchanged for 50 years."
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The best predictor for future behavior is past behavior: China is testing the waters, in some cases in a quite literal sense (South China Sea), and you're correct that how the world reacts to Hong Kong and the Xinjiang "re-education camps" will be seen as a vital piece of information in the future when deciding on how to proceed with other "problematic" regions: for example Taiwan, which in the case where strong-armi…
You forgot that Chinese invasion on Indian borders left some 50+ people killed just 3 months ago. You can't give a pass by saying "They're just testing waters". Everything in war is testing waters.
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Money & power are greater than protesting/democracy is what people are waking up to. It's been that way since forever but a lot of dogma keeps people docile to the idea that change is made from the "people" instead of a few elect individuals by birth with circumstances of wealth and power.
If the broad population decides you’re done; you’re done. Doesn’t matter what wealth or power you think you’ve got.
Lobbying has more power in congress than actual voting does.
The rest of the world needs to wake up and realize that China is not messing around. There will be a long list of Hong Kong’s if we continue to look the other way to authoritarian regimes.
US administration repeatedly failed to honour quite a number of defence treaties as of lately.
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War happens and is almost continually necessary to keep abusive and hurtful groups at bay. Go fight somewhere else when necessary/appropriate, or the the fight will come to you eventually. These are broad brush strokes, I know, but the principle holds true across the centuries.
Not an easy decision to make, when nuclear weapon exists. And that "somewhere else" --- wherever that is --- is someone's home. Please don't say it as if it's a duel in the wilderness.
Nuclear deterrance works when one party is actually suicidal and weak (North Korea), because if they smell blood, it will be serious. It doesn't work when both states are on equal footing - neither one is going to push the red button when there are other options to solve the disputes such as traditional skirmishes.
The rest of the world needs to wake up and realize that China is not messing around. There will be a long list of Hong Kong’s if we continue to look the other way to authoritarian regimes.
In the last decade : - Russia annexed Crimea; - Turkey took control of most of the Syrian land across its borders; - Israel continuously colonised bits of Palestinian land; - China is now taking political control of Hong Kong; - UAE forces tool over the Socotra Islands; The West's reactions so far have been ranging from ineffectual economic sanctions to completely ignoring it. I would expect similar "annexations" by…
Hongkong is a Chinese territory that was annexed by a European colonial power then handed back (so pretty much exactly what the US want to see, right?). China is not annexing any foreign territory, it's managing its territory the way it sees fit. The aim of making noise is to create trouble for the Chinese government, it's a cynical, but classic, game with HK used as pawn because, of course, the West does not actually generously care about HK, they have 'friends' who manage their countries in the same way or worse.
Crimea is objectionable because of the method used. But no-one is willing to make too much noise because it's Russia, sure, but also because everyone knows that Crimea was Russian territory until the 1950s when it was moved to Ukraine by the USSR and because the majority of the population is Russian and quite happy with being back in Russia. When the time is right for everyone to save face and get something this will be accepted and everyone will move on.
On the other hand Turkey has indeed very plainly invaded a foreign country. But they are good friends of ours (well... at least still friends strategically). Arguably the same goes for Israel.
Love how when the same restrictions are imposed in the USA, everyone starts talking about "doing the right thing"
Does anyone here have an informed opinion on what will happen to Taiwan?
Some other mainland Chinese people are more nuanced in their thoughts. I have no idea about population percentages for opinions. But this a world-class top 20 MBA school, and had one undergraduate student die while protesting (fell off a building). Bunch of these classmates are educated with masters degrees from American universities. If they default to war, I'm a bit concerned, I'd expect them to see more nuance in the world. For them, it's not really war of course, as Taiwan was always theirs in the first place in their eyes. Any foreign interference in the matter is a slap in the face of Chinese sovereignty, was the same for Hong Kong.
Hong Kong is a difficult situation because the entire world agrees that Hong Kong belongs to China. Taiwan is difficult in that most of the world has agreed that Taiwan belongs to China, that is the crux of the One China policy that China forces all countries to agree to if they want to have diplomatic and trade relations with China. If you break with the One China policy, you break diplomatic and trade relations with China. Don't see most countries willing to take that step. Big game of chicken.
For what it's worth, the Chinese government's official stance is that military action is a last resort option only if diplomatic negotiations fail.
What has happened to Hong Kong is a strong canary-in-the-coal-mine indicator for other Chinese territorial disputes [i]. With Hong Kong it was somewhat inevitable but I can't help but imagine how different it would be if the US and EU/Britain (as leads) would have strongly denounced their approach. I suspect in a decade from now the West will be lamenting how Hong Kong was the right opportunity to stifle China's ambi…
There's a reason Russia and China are bold right now.
EDIT: I get it, it's politically charged, but I remind everyone to discuss, rather than downvote, based on your own political opinion.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
This probably implies violence/war. Not many want violence these days.
War happens and is almost continually necessary to keep abusive and hurtful groups at bay. Go fight somewhere else when necessary/appropriate, or the the fight will come to you eventually. These are broad brush strokes, I know, but the principle holds true across the centuries.