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Tesla Ventilator

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Re: Tesla Ventilator

#61

Post by baybal2 »

xenonite wrote: post #51
baybal2 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If this fails, the patient can die. In the current situation, I doubt anybody will give any regard to your sentiment. Though, I myself will. > The smarter idea is to ramp up existing proven designs, not reinvent the wheel and basically do a publicity stunt about your engineering talent. This is what China did. Ctrl-C, Ctrl-V, and knockoff ventilators began to fly off assembly lines in less than a month. P.S. In oth…

I'm not so sure about your conclusion of banning exports. Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported." Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality?

> Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported."

> Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality?

May be, but the motivation for such regulation coming out of nowhere, and subsequent closing of reasonable exceptions, is not good at all.

It effectively reduced the number of eligible exporters from thousands to single digits per province, mostly completely irrelevant to fighting the epidemic.

This was regulation was made with 100% deliberate intent to be impossible to comply in order to shut down exports, without overtly announcing that they do that.

As of now, pretty much every medical export out of China is being smuggled, and bribed through the customs.

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#62

Post by throwmamatrain »

pdq wrote: post #27

Yes, this is an impressive amount of work done in a few weeks by a small team at Tesla. However, medical devices, especially for life support systems, are not a Hackathon project. These devices breathe air into patients lungs. They need to be manufactured in clean room conditions, with medical grade parts, not plumbing parts from a big box store. They must be designed and tested to ISO specifications. If this fails,…

When you have nothing, this is something. Stick to software.

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#63

Post by baybal2 »

bonestamp2 wrote: post #55
baybal2 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If this fails, the patient can die. In the current situation, I doubt anybody will give any regard to your sentiment. Though, I myself will. > The smarter idea is to ramp up existing proven designs, not reinvent the wheel and basically do a publicity stunt about your engineering talent. This is what China did. Ctrl-C, Ctrl-V, and knockoff ventilators began to fly off assembly lines in less than a month. P.S. In oth…

From the article: > of the 102 Chinese companies with CE accreditation, just 21 were licensed to sell their products within China It's not clear to me what they're trying to do here. Why did they make this new law that prevents 80% of the accredited companies from exporting medical supplies?

> It's not clear

I think it's 100% clear.

> Why did they make this new law that prevents 80% of the accredited companies from exporting medical supplies?

Your questions already has an answer: that was made with that exact intent.

As I wrote above, even things that should not require any medical certification as such, like medical clothing and bedding, are now being turned around at customs. And those few random companies having full certifications, are turned around at customs too!

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#64

Post by bonestamp2 »

LittleNemoInS wrote: post #28

This is not Tesla, but Seat has already done it : https://www.seat.com/company/news/company/from-making-cars-t... Less techie, more down to earth, they used wipe motors.

That's great. I hope wiper motors can take that kind of continuous actuation -- it's not really what they're designed for. I'm sure they'll stress test the hell out of it.

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#65

Post by DanBC »

baybal2 wrote: post #61
xenonite wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not so sure about your conclusion of banning exports. Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported." Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality?

> Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported." > Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality? May be, but the motivation for such regulation coming out of nowhere, and subsequent closing of reasonable exceptions, is not good at all. It effectively reduced the number of eligi…

It's not coming out of nowhere. We've already seen hundreds of thousands of defective face masks, and hundreds of thousands of under-performing tests, being shipped: https://www.euronews.com/2020/03/29/netherlands-recalls-hund...

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#66

Post by heleninboodler »

zodo123 wrote: post #24
heleninboodler wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious what the mixing chamber is used for in an electric vehicle. Is it part of the climate control system?

It said “Continental” as the manufacturer on it. If I had to guess, I would say it was the reservoir for their adjustable height air suspension.

Ah yes, that makes a lot of sense. It looks quite beefy for climate control.

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#67

Post by [deleted] »

pdq wrote: post #27

Yes, this is an impressive amount of work done in a few weeks by a small team at Tesla. However, medical devices, especially for life support systems, are not a Hackathon project. These devices breathe air into patients lungs. They need to be manufactured in clean room conditions, with medical grade parts, not plumbing parts from a big box store. They must be designed and tested to ISO specifications. If this fails,…

[deleted]

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#68

Post by coredog64 »

bArray wrote: post #41
pdq wrote: post #27

Yes, this is an impressive amount of work done in a few weeks by a small team at Tesla. However, medical devices, especially for life support systems, are not a Hackathon project. These devices breathe air into patients lungs. They need to be manufactured in clean room conditions, with medical grade parts, not plumbing parts from a big box store. They must be designed and tested to ISO specifications. If this fails,…

> If this fails, the patient can die. If these patients receive no help, they die anyway. Given the choice between almost certain death or some experimental piece of hardware - give me the experimental hardware. > I can't imagine any hospital or doctor careless enough to > connect one of these to a patient, even in this current > emergency. I'm sure they will go through accelerated testing. > The smarter idea is to r…

The US already has a model for this though: During WW2, Ford Motor Company didn't stroke Henry Ford's ego by designing and building their own bombers -- they license built B-24s.

Yes, retooling costs. But tooling costs as well, and costs more besides.

With Elon's PR reach, I would expect that he could get at least one vent manufacturer to license a design to him for a dollar/handshake/whatever.

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#69

Post by bonestamp2 »

baybal2 wrote: post #63
bonestamp2 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From the article: > of the 102 Chinese companies with CE accreditation, just 21 were licensed to sell their products within China It's not clear to me what they're trying to do here. Why did they make this new law that prevents 80% of the accredited companies from exporting medical supplies?

> It's not clear I think it's 100% clear. > Why did they make this new law that prevents 80% of the accredited companies from exporting medical supplies? Your questions already has an answer: that was made with that exact intent. As I wrote above, even things that should not require any medical certification as such, like medical clothing and bedding, are now being turned around at customs. And those few random compa…

Sorry, I should have been more clear and concise. Why do they want to limit exports from certified companies?

Re: Tesla Ventilator

#70

Post by throw487654 »

baybal2 wrote: post #61
xenonite wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not so sure about your conclusion of banning exports. Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported." Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality?

> Your link at SCMP says "companies must demonstrate to the Chinese customs agency that their products meet the relevant standards of the countries to which there goods are being exported." > Isn't this also a good idea to ensure quality? May be, but the motivation for such regulation coming out of nowhere, and subsequent closing of reasonable exceptions, is not good at all. It effectively reduced the number of eligi…

The motivation appears to come from recent news articles about how Chinese tests don’t work, or their respirators are faulty.

It turned out it was because non-certified Chinese companies were exporting these products, so the government cracked down.

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