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Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

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Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I trust the sourcing of my food as far as I can trust the vendor. We have a CSA (community supported agriculture) share with a local farm; despite them not having organic certification (pretty typical for CSAs in my experience—they'd rather build trust directly than via a third party), I know their produce to be much more sustainable than anything I could buy at a grocery store.

What makes it more sustainable?

IMHO, there are quite a few reasons small "organic" (certified or not) farms like our CSA are more sustainable:

- Small scale focuses more on adapting crops to the land rather than adapting land to the crops (using fertilizer, pesticides, herbicides, irrigation, etc.)

- Crop rotation allows the land to produce more yield in the same space without chemical augmentation

- Reduced emissions from transportation (the farm is about 10 miles away)

- Fresher means better taste, so we eat more vegetables—and therefore less meat; and we also throw away less food (especially since our CSA uses a points system that allows us to choose veggies we're more likely to eat)

- Reduced packaging use

- No treatments required to preserve freshness (I know someone who has a severe intolerance for corn who has to be extremely careful with fresh vegetables, as they're often sprayed with a corn-based preservative)

- More genetic variety, since freight-tolerance isn't nearly as important

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#63
post #51

> habitat loss, the use of pesticides, disease and the changing climate have all likely contributed to the decline of western monarchs We can dance around proximal causes all we want, but all environmental roads lead to overpopulation. Most people associate acting on population with China forcing abortions or tearing down homes, or racist eugenics policies or forced sterilizations. That's why when I talk about overpo…

population is an obsessive topic with lots of underlying psychological baggage, so much so as it is almost pointless to start listing. 100,000 caves dwellers versus 12,000 cave dwellers in some proportionally larger area (e.g. New Mexico) would have how much "impact" ? One Chernobyl for 120,000 people versus 1,000,000 people over a proportionate area (Ukraine) has how much effect? etc..

Large topics often bring out more the personal obsessions of the commentors.. therefore, take the time to specifically refute this comment point-of-view...

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#64
> population has declined by over 99 percent

> This year's estimate [...] stands at about 29,000 monarchs, just above last year’s all-time low

> Federal officials are considering listing monarch butterflies for protection under the Endangered Species Act

Very disappointing that the feds are moving so slowly.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#65
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While this is true, and I agree, this insight has been obvious for at least the last 40 years. Seeing the change is unfortunately very different than bringing the change. I am afraid most people need the emergency at their own doorstep before they are truly willing to act and make sacrifices to their way of living.

Have you stopped buying plastic? Have you stopped buying the myriad "cleaning" products which pollute your home and create pollution in the process of being produced? Have you stopped buying disposable clothing and plastic trinkets? If you are still buying these things, you are complicit in this ecocide. And now you know it, too. Once you stop yourself, you can tell others, too. Without making changes in your own act…

We are facing a tragedy of the commons, and individual action does not solve that. This holds true for overfishing, pollution, greenhouse gas emissions, you name it. The change we need is pigovian taxes, which factor negative externalities into the price of the activity causing it, instead of letting them be amortised by society. Consumer-shaming is not how we solve a tragedy of the commons.

If half the world stops burning fossil fuels tomorrow, the other half will enjoy cheaper oil and double their emissions the next day. Tax pollutants.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#66
post #9

Maybe worth noting: we've lost about half of Earth's wildlife in the past 40 years. [1] [1] https://www.worldwildlife.org/press-releases/wwf-report-reve...

Also maybe worth noting: we've gained about half the Earth's population of humans in the past 40-50 years.

These two facts are almost certainly related.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#67
I remember first visiting Santa Cruz in the 90s and being disappointed to be early for what was still expected to be a magnificent season.

Earlier this winter I was splitting an old log pile and disturbed three hibernating monarchs. I felt like a real jerk for waking them up. I hope they survived, and learned to be more careful disturbing the more obvious hibernation sites in the garden.

I wish my connection with nature had come earlier in life.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#68
post #51

> habitat loss, the use of pesticides, disease and the changing climate have all likely contributed to the decline of western monarchs We can dance around proximal causes all we want, but all environmental roads lead to overpopulation. Most people associate acting on population with China forcing abortions or tearing down homes, or racist eugenics policies or forced sterilizations. That's why when I talk about overpo…

> That's why when I talk about overpopulation, I talk about success cases like Thailand. Or how Mexico's soap operas helped lower that nation's birth rate. These cases brought prosperity, stability, and abundance.

Can you elaborate on these and/or provide links?

At first thought it seems absurd that telenovelas could significantly impact the birthrate.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#69
post #51

> habitat loss, the use of pesticides, disease and the changing climate have all likely contributed to the decline of western monarchs We can dance around proximal causes all we want, but all environmental roads lead to overpopulation. Most people associate acting on population with China forcing abortions or tearing down homes, or racist eugenics policies or forced sterilizations. That's why when I talk about overpo…

IUDs and vasectomies encourage the kind of life that uses created things instead of receives them. Which, counterintuitively, will increase the rate of consumption, not reduce it. Family planning is good when it plans to receive, not when it plans to demand.

Re: Just 29k Western Monarch butterflies are left in California

#70
post #51

> habitat loss, the use of pesticides, disease and the changing climate have all likely contributed to the decline of western monarchs We can dance around proximal causes all we want, but all environmental roads lead to overpopulation. Most people associate acting on population with China forcing abortions or tearing down homes, or racist eugenics policies or forced sterilizations. That's why when I talk about overpo…

> That's why when I talk about overpopulation, I talk about success cases like Thailand. Or how Mexico's soap operas helped lower that nation's birth rate. These cases brought prosperity, stability, and abundance. Can you elaborate on these and/or provide links? At first thought it seems absurd that telenovelas could significantly impact the birthrate.

My introduction came from Alan Weisman's book Countdown. I did a couple podcast episodes on it: https://shows.acast.com/leadership-and-the-environment/episo... and https://shows.acast.com/leadership-and-the-environment/episo....

Here's a New York Times article on Mexican soap operas and family planning https://www.nytimes.com/1982/01/05/world/soap-opera-in-mexic...

This article covers soap operas around the world and family planning http://utminers.utep.edu/asinghal/Articles%20and%20Chapters/....

Search results with more https://duckduckgo.com/?q=mexico+family+planning+soap+opera&....

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