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Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

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Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#61

Post by cco »

casion wrote: post #15
umvi wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We wake up students too early Based on what you just said, if we moved school to 10am, you would just stay up until 4am playing StarCraft. I don't think school is too early. I think you just stayed up too late.

I don't think this is true. When I was younger, I only could fall asleep at ~2am. I went to multiple schools with starting times varying from 5am to 12pm, it never made a difference. I just wasn't tired until 2am no matter what.

Did you use artificial light anytime after the sun went down?

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#62

Post by pengstrom »

gruez wrote: post #19
sb057 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that logic, if we moved school to 5 am, he would have simply only stayed up until 10 pm. Is that particularly realistic?

>By that logic, if we moved school to 5 am, he would have simply only stayed up until 10 pm. I believe that. >Is that particularly realistic? The only issue is that at 5am, there won't be daylight during the winter. Lack of daylight presents safety issues and makes it more difficult to wake up.

Haha, you'd like our winters then. If you look out during lectures you might catch the brief sunlight.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#63

Post by clarry »

thrower123 wrote: post #42
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While there is truth to what you are saying, there is no particular requirement for stating a day with a standup. I find it's a glorified catch-up session and can be held equally successfully at 2pm. People can generally use their morning productively without it. I also find written form of standup more valuable than the verbal one.

I agree completely. I'm certainly far more productive in the morning if there is not a standup or some recurring daily meeting scheduled... That defined interruption imposes a big cost in productivity beforehand. It squeezes everything. Why standups couldn't just be a handful of bullet points from each person when they spin up for the day in a Slack channel is something I have never quite understood.

No standups where I work. If I need to know what my coworkers are up to, I just ask them. If they need to know what I'm up to, they ask me. Works great. We rarely need to ask. If there is an issue that affects multiple people, we can talk about it on the issue tracker, where we see commits too.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#64

Post by Broken_Hippo »

cco wrote: post #61
casion wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is true. When I was younger, I only could fall asleep at ~2am. I went to multiple schools with starting times varying from 5am to 12pm, it never made a difference. I just wasn't tired until 2am no matter what.

Did you use artificial light anytime after the sun went down?

Wouldn't one assume the folks use artificial light? People have been doing this well before electricity, especially during the winter. Doubly so up north. There simply isn't enough day here during the winter to do otherwise. Heck, my sunset time today is estimated at 16:22. I'll not have eaten dinner yet.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#65

Post by jay_kyburz »

wrktanice wrote: post #53
cgriswald wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sleepiness in humans is driven by the number of hours they remain awake and by time of day, more or less independently. In teens sleep onset as a result of these are both delayed relative to children and adults. Certainly there are cases where tired teens stay up because they are stimulated the same as happens in adults. But generally speaking, teens don’t stay up because they are playing Starcraft. They play Starcra…

> teens don’t stay up because they are playing Starcraft. They play Starcraft because they are up. This is, at least in my experience, completely untrue. When I play Starcraft, I'll easily play till 2-3 am before I start feeling tired. And I'd continue playing, but I'm literally succumbing to exhaustion at that point. If I force myself to before that, say midnight, I start feeling tired almost immediately. And if I d…

Yeah, I'm nearly 50, and I never start a new game of anything after 9 because it wakes me up to much, I can easily find myself still playing and not tired at all after midnight. I need at least an hour of winding down after gaming before bed.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#66

Post by sabas123 »

MperorM wrote: post #3

Lack of sleep was definitely the cause of my terrible grades in highschool mathematics. I would stay up late (1-2 am) to play in starcraft tournaments, to have 8 am classes in mathematics. (There's a neat inverse correlation between my highschool grades and starcraft rank) It's crazy to me just how terrible school systems are at optimizing for learning. I would get terrible headaches from classrooms that had too many…

Which tournaments did you play in? Good old SC ruined my high school but god damn did I learn much from playing it competitively.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#67

Post by Broken_Hippo »

gruez wrote: post #19
sb057 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By that logic, if we moved school to 5 am, he would have simply only stayed up until 10 pm. Is that particularly realistic?

>By that logic, if we moved school to 5 am, he would have simply only stayed up until 10 pm. I believe that. >Is that particularly realistic? The only issue is that at 5am, there won't be daylight during the winter. Lack of daylight presents safety issues and makes it more difficult to wake up.

I've never lived somewhere that had decent daylight in the morning. When I lived in the states, it wasn't light outside until 8am or something in the winter. I now live in Norway, and december days are less than 5 hours long where I am - and the light isn't very strong.

Perhaps 5am is just a difficult time to wake up.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#69

Post by jay_kyburz »

ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #34
thrower123 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't much like standups, but I've noticed that they tend to end up being a hard start to the day. When we had them at 9:30, people would tend to always get in to the office by at least 9:15. When we kick them back to 10:30, people tend to straggle in up to 10, 10:15. Generally, people adjust to whatever the time is, so they have some minutes to get settled and triage their email; you usually can't actually get any…

As one of those people, it's because, as a developer, I hate knowing I'm going to be interrupted in X amount of time. Obviously if it was something like 11, 1130, it'd be different. But if with no standup I'd get to the office at 915, but the standup is at 10, I don't think I'd get any valuable piece of work done in that 45 minutes.

I always used that time to clear my inbox and read the internet. Get those early distractions out of the way.

Re: Around 30 percent of children in the U.S. don't get enough sleep: study

#70

Post by jay_kyburz »

asveikau wrote: post #27
flerchin wrote: post #13

Everyone, not just kids. Go the fuck to bed. In my experience, it's the same parents that struggle to make it to 930 standups that also let their kids stay up too late.

Are you a parent? Getting kids awake, some food, to school on time, and then a work commute is hard. It might just be that you are observing.

My kids are only 6 and 7 but they are up first and can mostly do they rest themselves. I just have to work out how to get them to carry that through to the teenage years.
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