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Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

theverge.com

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Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#61
post #49
post #11

Kudos to Google's contractor for offering this opportunity to the people who need it most. I would happily sell anyone a picture or scan of my face for $5. But I would even more happily have that chance go to someone who needs it more than myself. This article also mentions that the contractor may have lied to or misled the homeless, which is deplorable. But the behavior described by the title itself is nothing objec…

This, if $0 + not giving face instead of $5 was a superior choice, the homeless would have chosen it, but they didnt.

That argument applies equally well to buying kidneys from homeless people for $20. I hope we agree that that's bad.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#62
post #11

Kudos to Google's contractor for offering this opportunity to the people who need it most. I would happily sell anyone a picture or scan of my face for $5. But I would even more happily have that chance go to someone who needs it more than myself. This article also mentions that the contractor may have lied to or misled the homeless, which is deplorable. But the behavior described by the title itself is nothing objec…

What if it was one dollar instead of five? It would have saved hundreds of thousands for Randstad. Or if google is paying for it and this feature motivates 1% more people to buy the phone, they could be making a lot of money. I bet loads of homeless would be fine with $1 for a snapshot. How does the outcome differ for all these homeless people in this case?

What if they could have bargained for $10 or even more instead? I don’t think either company would even blink at the sum, but many desperate people out there would be a lot better off.

I agree with you that some observers are never going to be satisfied and to them there’s always more an individual or a company can do. There is definitely an observer effect.

Similarly, If we took my line of questioning all the way to an absurd extreme, the best outcome would be if all these people got permanent shelter, jobs, and a stable life. But we can’t expect companies with profit targets to do this them. Nobody would feel bad about this exchange, but it would be pretty unrealistic.

So i guess I need to reframe my original question. Why do certain exchanges feel ok while other ones leave a sour taste in everybody’s mouth?

To me it seems like the answer is because the exchange felt unfair. Both parties stand to benefit but, instead of doing something genuinely beneficial for both, the party in power offered the (almost) bare minimum. That sense of unfairness is multiplied when you contextualize the exchange as Very Large Business vs. Small Homeless Person.

Similarly the link to the phenomenon discusses our role as observers, but it doesn’t discuss the parties’ roles in the exchanges. They’re not only observers, they’re also actors. The people performing the homeless study could, for example offered something to the control group at the completion of the experiment.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#63
post #49
post #11

Kudos to Google's contractor for offering this opportunity to the people who need it most. I would happily sell anyone a picture or scan of my face for $5. But I would even more happily have that chance go to someone who needs it more than myself. This article also mentions that the contractor may have lied to or misled the homeless, which is deplorable. But the behavior described by the title itself is nothing objec…

This, if $0 + not giving face instead of $5 was a superior choice, the homeless would have chosen it, but they didnt.

Homeless are that way for a reason. Logical thinking isn’t it.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#65
post #11

Kudos to Google's contractor for offering this opportunity to the people who need it most. I would happily sell anyone a picture or scan of my face for $5. But I would even more happily have that chance go to someone who needs it more than myself. This article also mentions that the contractor may have lied to or misled the homeless, which is deplorable. But the behavior described by the title itself is nothing objec…

> which is deplorable. But

There is always a but

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#66
Next news: Google engineer sneezes in subway, google trying to infect people.

I mean there's no need to have google's name in there, other than to click-bait-trick people into viewing their subpar journalism with ads.

But, It's kinda shitty to cheat people no matter what. You cannot say hey pixel 4 is gonna have face unlock and i want you face scanned for that obviously, but contractor should have done a better job.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#67

There's a long, long history of leaving women, people of color, poor people and other groups out of data sets. For example, I've read articles that indicate we can't create good photos of people of color because film standards were normalized to white skin. So, try to fix that and... there's hell to pay? File under: "No good deed goes unpunished."

But now they have a dataset where a disproportionate proportion (possibly the last majority) of people of color represented were homeless.

That's bound to introduce other kinds of bias into the data.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#68

I remember the outrage when people discovered that Google's AI wasn't properly trained on black faces. It makes sense that they try hard to avoid that happening again by paying black people to let Google scan their faces. It is not unethical to try to diversify your training data. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/google/11710136/Googl... Anyway, this part sounds directly illegal, seems like it was just Randstad…

I feel like they were needlessly dishonest and misleading and that being truthful would have gotten more people on board. Saying something along the lines of "hey, we noticed our facial recognition algorithms don't work so well for African Americans. Could you help us fix that by letting us take a picture of your face? We'll give you a $5 gift card for your troubles."

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#69
post #38
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would happily sell anyone a picture or scan of my face for $5. But I even more happily have that chance go to someone who needs it more than myself. Would you really? My gut feeling tells me that's not the case for most people for privacy or ethical reasons. Just because those people are poor, we expect them to have lower privacy or ethical standards. The link you posted has the following example, I think you're…

If you or anyone: - Provides a link or method to create the scan that takes just a few minutes (on Ubuntu) - Sends $5 to kauffj@gmail.com via PayPal or via BTC to 17h2GtaBzivnNtP24qoGg4a3pjgShkw7MD I will complete the process and post the result in this thread.

What's your point?

You choose to do it because you don't care about giving your face picture to someone, fine. You're in a totally different position, financially independent I assume, you can weigh your options.

A homeless person might not be in a situation like that. They're much more vulnerable and possibly willing to do things out of sheer desperation. Things they wouldn't do if they were in a different situation.

Re: Google contractors reportedly targeted homeless people for facial recognition

#70
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This, if $0 + not giving face instead of $5 was a superior choice, the homeless would have chosen it, but they didnt.

That argument applies equally well to buying kidneys from homeless people for $20. I hope we agree that that's bad.

Oh come on, surely you must realize that selling limited copyright to a digital likeness of your face is much different than selling a literal body part.
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