This is the ultimate humble brag. To work at the leading cloud operation would be an honor.
> To work at the leading cloud operation would be an honor.
Not if they treat you like garbage.
Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
61–70 of 365 posts
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#62> Come on, AWS. Do better than this. The advantages are too significant. If a company of sufficient size isn't doing this, they're doing something else. Statistically, employees cannot win; there may be outliers where an employee prevails, but in the aggregate, the company will win — and that makes these draconian policies worthwhile. Companies enjoy economies of scale when it comes to negotiating employment, because…
There is also a thing called unions.
The tech industry has the best horizontal mobility of any other right now. Why do we need the downside of unions when we can just move company and have only the upsides?
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#63This is the ultimate humble brag. To work at the leading cloud operation would be an honor.
> This is the ultimate humble brag.
Maybe it is, maybe it isn't.
But the point still stands: that non-compete is draconian. Whilst I highly doubt Amazon would be interested in me, I would not be interested in working for them or any other company that could potentially bar me from making a living for any significant period of time after leaving.
At the most basic level I need to pay my mortgage and household bills, I need to buy groceries, I need to fuel and service my car; maybe I've got a family I need to provide for.
And what's the point of saving from a great salary if you need to spend 18 months burning through those savings after you leave the job? And in what world are most employers going to be willing to wait 18 months to take you on?
Seldom enforced is not the same as never enforced. Humblebrag or not, it sounds like a smart decision to me.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#64I've also turned down countless Amazon interview offers. In fact, I don't get how I'm still on their recruitment lists after asking several times to be removed. Amazon has arguably the worst culture out of any large tech company, and generally treats its workers like dirt. Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they ha…
There is no such thing as a "recruitment list" to be removed from, unless you remove all traces of yourself from the internet. Sourcers don't work from a shared list. Also, you might be surprised to hear how often people will say "no" at one point, and later say "yes." Circumstances change. Asking again later works.
There is certainly a recruitment list.
I get emails from Amazon that start with the sentence "We already know that you applied in 2012, do you want to try again?" or something similar.
I have asked twice to remove me from their applicant database.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#65I've also turned down countless Amazon interview offers. In fact, I don't get how I'm still on their recruitment lists after asking several times to be removed. Amazon has arguably the worst culture out of any large tech company, and generally treats its workers like dirt. Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they ha…
Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they have the second highest employee turnover out of all Fortune 500 companies[1]. Do you think any of the tech companies would treat their blue collar workers any better? It just so happens that all of the products produced by Google, Microsoft and Apple that need a lot of blue collar workers are done by contractors in a different country. I bet none of the…
I've also heard bad things about white-collar work in their logistics area.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
exit interview advice (applies everywhere): politely decline the exit interview. there is zero upside to doing an exit interview
Call me a naïf, but I think exit interviews are a great way to speak candidly to skip-level managers about dissatisfactions you have—with the aim of making the company you’re leaving potentially a bit better for your colleagues. EDIT: I think “feedback” here is somewhat vague. You guys are talking about issues there would be no point in raising. For me this is not systemic issues. I would bring up more minor things,…
I think it's both admirable and naive. My experience with upper management is that it rots from the top, so if you're quitting due to systemic issues or because of your boss, it's very likely due in part to upper management's inability to listen before something blows up.
In game theory terms it's pretty much all downside. If you say nothing or if management sends exit interviews straight to the recycle bin, there is zero payoff for you and zero payoff for anyone else. If you say something and management is bad at listening, you burn bridges and nobody else benefits. If you say something and management is good, you get nothing and others after you benefit. More often than not management is bad at listening. In other words, it never improves anything for you and rarely improves anything for others.
I used to be a strong believer in giving honest feedback during exit interviews, but I definitely don't anymore. If upper management actually cared, they would have gotten and acted on the same feedback from current employees, before they quit. I no longer believe in offering crappy management the privilege of a "I quit" wake-up call at the risk of my own professional reputation/relationships.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#67Earlier quoted context omitted.
exit interview advice (applies everywhere): politely decline the exit interview. there is zero upside to doing an exit interview
Call me a naïf, but I think exit interviews are a great way to speak candidly to skip-level managers about dissatisfactions you have—with the aim of making the company you’re leaving potentially a bit better for your colleagues. EDIT: I think “feedback” here is somewhat vague. You guys are talking about issues there would be no point in raising. For me this is not systemic issues. I would bring up more minor things,…
if they really cared to fix it, it wouldn't take you leaving.
i guess it depends on who's doing the exit interview. i could see it being beneficial if you have a lot of experience and trust with the manager doing the exit interview (e.g because he managed you before he got promoted). but if you've barely spoken to the person doing the exit interview, it's best to politely decline or simply shut up, so as not to burn bridges.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#68I've also turned down countless Amazon interview offers. In fact, I don't get how I'm still on their recruitment lists after asking several times to be removed. Amazon has arguably the worst culture out of any large tech company, and generally treats its workers like dirt. Given all my friends that worked for them, almost all have quit within 5 years. Given their abysmal warehouse management, it's no surprise they ha…
There is no such thing as a "recruitment list" to be removed from, unless you remove all traces of yourself from the internet. Sourcers don't work from a shared list. Also, you might be surprised to hear how often people will say "no" at one point, and later say "yes." Circumstances change. Asking again later works.
> Sourcers don't work from a shared list.
Presumably they do have a referral database, though. I can't remember the exact verbiage, and can't be bothered to go digging for the emails, but I know I've received several similar solicits after asking to be removed from their referral pipeline.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
exit interview advice (applies everywhere): politely decline the exit interview. there is zero upside to doing an exit interview
Call me a naïf, but I think exit interviews are a great way to speak candidly to skip-level managers about dissatisfactions you have—with the aim of making the company you’re leaving potentially a bit better for your colleagues. EDIT: I think “feedback” here is somewhat vague. You guys are talking about issues there would be no point in raising. For me this is not systemic issues. I would bring up more minor things,…
In my experience, the problem with your thinking is that it doesn't play out that way.
If management is open to criticism and will actually use that feedback to make changes, you probably realize that fact and have already been giving candid feedback.
If they're not open to it, then your openness is just going to burn a bridge. It feels good, and you may not care in the moment, but at beat it's neutral. At worst it hurts you down the road.
Re: Why I Turned Down an AWS Job Offer
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
exit interview advice (applies everywhere): politely decline the exit interview. there is zero upside to doing an exit interview
Call me a naïf, but I think exit interviews are a great way to speak candidly to skip-level managers about dissatisfactions you have—with the aim of making the company you’re leaving potentially a bit better for your colleagues. EDIT: I think “feedback” here is somewhat vague. You guys are talking about issues there would be no point in raising. For me this is not systemic issues. I would bring up more minor things,…
i think that your feedback can and will be misinterpreted to fit a narrative about you leaving. your feedback will also be regarded as biased (you are leaving, right?).
the best time to provide feedback is while you still have the job. when you see something that does not work speak up. when the time to go comes, nothing you say should surprise anyone therefore no need for the exit interview and everyone having a bad time in this emotionally charged moments.