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Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

reuters.com

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Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#61

Post by salawat »

throw20102010 wrote: post #43
strikelaserclaw wrote: post #42

"possible solution to the driver shortage and regulatory constraints faced by freight haulers across the country" - mmm, every industry is facing worker shortage huh -.-

Unemployment is very low right now. However, the most accurate statement is always, "shortage of people that have the qualifications we want that are willing to work for the payment we're offering."

Note: Unemployment is measured through participation in various workfinding government programs or receipt of unemployment benefits.

It doesn't really paint an accurate picture of how many are out of work, but getting by through alternative or illegal-quasi-legal means.

It also in no way measures the number of jobs a defined unit of work can supply, or whether the job itself creates enough of a return to be economically feasible to the doer.

It also in no way reflects that many jobs mow push for pre-acquired qualifications, which cost money, and lock out potential workforce.

No one wants to measure any of that. That leads to awkward questions.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#62

Post by kingnothing »

bluedino wrote: post #58
strikelaserclaw wrote: post #42

"possible solution to the driver shortage and regulatory constraints faced by freight haulers across the country" - mmm, every industry is facing worker shortage huh -.-

A friend of mine has a son (22 years old) who just started driving a semi truck for one of the big 'Dollar' store chains. Pays $680 a week, he's home every 2 weeks, and as a bonus he gets to unload the truck. Not a terrible job, but not many people want to work that schedule, and a life on the road isn't probably ideal.

Assuming a 50 week year, that's $34k per year, or roughly $17 per hour. No wonder people don't want that job. You work completely alone driving all day for not much more than minimum wage.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#64

Post by keanebean86 »

skykooler wrote: post #59

How is the package actually delivered if there's no driver?

Trebuchet?

They could have a notification app or send an email/text that the delivery is there. The person would then waddle out to the delivery truck.

Drone, robot, or mechanical arm thing.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#65

Post by oldgradstudent »

0xffff2 wrote: post #52
linuxftw wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. This is a big nothing-burger. I can create a self-driving car as long as there's a real driver behind the wheel when needed. It doesn't say anything about how much autonomy is actually expected. Semi's can't react as quickly to changing conditions as a Tesla. Rolling carnage. This will never work.

>Semi's can't react as quickly to changing conditions as a Tesla. That's true whether there's a human driving or a computer. The only relevant distinction for a semi or a Tesla is whether the computer can react faster and make better decisions than a human driver would.

Yes, but so far, no one has ever demonstrated a computer that is even remotely competitive with a human driver.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#66

Post by esilver »

mijamo wrote: post #55
esilver wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The in-vehicle monitor will likely be a standard part of autonomous and semi-autonomous trucking for the foreseeable future. A monitor can be paid less than a driver, as they’re doing less work, and can respond to onsite issues more promptly and accurately than could a remote one.

I don't think the quantity of work matters at all for salary. A monitor probably needs more knowledge than a driver (need to know the specifics of the product, how to fix problems etc.), and has the same downsides (long hours, not especially exciting job, bad work hours, sitting all the time etc.). If anything I would think they would be paid more.

It would be wholly dependent on the load and the technical implementation.

In my view the monitor would be a driver with standard knowledge and experience who could drive if the autonomous system encountered an edge case or for last-mile, i.e., from the freeway to the shipping or receiving facility.

Under those circumstances a load traveling ten hours with six hours of loading and unloading time would require two hours of active work and fourteen hours of standby.

Any driver would accept a lower rate for this kind of arrangement.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#67

Post by linuxftw »

0xffff2 wrote: post #52
linuxftw wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. This is a big nothing-burger. I can create a self-driving car as long as there's a real driver behind the wheel when needed. It doesn't say anything about how much autonomy is actually expected. Semi's can't react as quickly to changing conditions as a Tesla. Rolling carnage. This will never work.

>Semi's can't react as quickly to changing conditions as a Tesla. That's true whether there's a human driving or a computer. The only relevant distinction for a semi or a Tesla is whether the computer can react faster and make better decisions than a human driver would.

Wrong. Driving a commercial vehicle requires a license that is more difficult to maintain, and for good reason: It's much harder to safely operate than a standard passenger vehicle.

Tesla and other 'Autonomous Driving solutions' are missing parity in the 'contextual awareness' space IMO. Safely operating a commercial vehicle is very much about 'contextual awareness'. Car cuts you off unexpectedly? Easy, slam the brakes in a Tesla. Truck? Crash and kill the people in front of you. You have to be able to absolutely anticipate crazy drivers and their terrible habits like jumping in front of you in heavy traffic and having to stop hard.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#68

Post by gvb »

linsomniac wrote: post #6

Back in 1987, at my first job at Hewlett-Packard, they had a little robot that would deliver mail. This was their plant in Loveland, CO, I believe it was the first non-California site HP opened. Along the main hallways there was some sort of retroreflective tape laid down, and the robot, which looked like and equipment cart, would follow that tape. At every stop it would sound a chime and the secretary for that secti…

That was the Lear Siegler -> Bell & Howell -> Litton -> Dematic Mailmobile. It followed a fluorescent path using a blacklight sensor to guide it.

https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/mailmobiles-mail-robot...

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#69

Post by ceejayoz »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #19
linsomniac wrote: post #6

Back in 1987, at my first job at Hewlett-Packard, they had a little robot that would deliver mail. This was their plant in Loveland, CO, I believe it was the first non-California site HP opened. Along the main hallways there was some sort of retroreflective tape laid down, and the robot, which looked like and equipment cart, would follow that tape. At every stop it would sound a chime and the secretary for that secti…

IIRC the movie Space Camp (80s?) features a mail-robot, perhaps the kid hides in it?

There's one in the show The Americans, as well.

Re: Self-driving trucks begin mail delivery test for U.S. Postal Service

#70

Post by jsymolon »

esilver wrote: post #51
YeGoblynQueenne wrote: post #40

>> A safety driver will sit behind the wheel to intervene if necessary and an engineer will ride in the passenger seat. This is how you know a vehicle is self-driving: there are two people sat in the front.

The in-vehicle monitor will likely be a standard part of autonomous and semi-autonomous trucking for the foreseeable future. A monitor can be paid less than a driver, as they’re doing less work, and can respond to onsite issues more promptly and accurately than could a remote one.

> ... can be paid less than a driver, as they’re doing less work ...

Major West: And the monkey flips the switch. -- Lost In Space, 1998

Instructions can be, push the big red button if anything happens.

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