Apple announces Apple Card credit card • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#61

Post by thinkingkong » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:53 PM UTC

nabaraz wrote: post #25

With the rise of smartphone payments like Samsung Pay, Android Pay and Apple Pay , is there even a need for credit cards? How long until these companies start skipping payment processors like Visa and Mastercard and take the whole pie?

Apple Pay isnt special and its not a separate network. All the payment systems that take tap take these payment types.

There are other direct to bank account systems like Interac that skirt around the traditional “pay later” idea, without fees or benefits to the user.

All in all you could just do a direct to bank account NFC transaction but why would any company do that when they can build up an ecosystem?

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#62

Post by kevin_b_er » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:53 PM UTC

durability wrote: post #16

jak92 wrote: post #3

How is it private? Seems like all the metadata is still there...

In the stream they seem to suggest that it’s “private” in the sense of 1. Apple doesn’t get any information (it’s all done on-device) 2. The data GS gets (and probably needs to keep, for auditing/paper trail) they “will never sell.” This probably means they have some kind of special agreement? Not sure what MasterCard would get though.

As it goes thru mastercard's network, they will get who your card bought from, the [hidden] card number at the time, and the name on the card. Unless Apple has gotten mastercard to not generate any of that data, there's a standard CC hidden in there. There's also a name attached to it. Merchants get bits of this data for fraud prevention. They get it from Mastercard.

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#63

Post by bk_mtn_man » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:53 PM UTC

nabaraz wrote: post #25

With the rise of smartphone payments like Samsung Pay, Android Pay and Apple Pay , is there even a need for credit cards? How long until these companies start skipping payment processors like Visa and Mastercard and take the whole pie?

I don't live in a tech hub city but in all my shopping I have never seen anyone use one of the Apple/Samsung payment methods where I live. Even when I spent months in Silicon Valley I can count the number of times I saw it used on one hand.

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#64

Post by jumbopapa » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:54 PM UTC

athenot wrote: post #60

The 2% cashback is especially interesting (in the US, for purchases done with ApplePay). I guess they can get away with a different risk model when they control more of the payment process & security.

That's not really interesting at all. See Citi Double Cash, Fidelity Visa, PenFed Powercash...

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#65

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:54 PM UTC

ckastner wrote: post #4

> get a digital card that they can use anywhere Apple Pay Apply Pay users: how broad is Apply Pay adoption? Is this a viable replacement for a VISA, Mastercard or AMEX? I'm intrigued by the privacy angle to this, seeing as VISA and Mastercard apparently share and/or sell a lot of transaction data with/to third parties. Edit: The article has been updated: As rumored, Apple is partnering with Goldman Sachs for Apple Ca…

[deleted]

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#66

Post by spectramax » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

siculars wrote: post #34

ckastner wrote: post #4

> get a digital card that they can use anywhere Apple Pay Apply Pay users: how broad is Apply Pay adoption? Is this a viable replacement for a VISA, Mastercard or AMEX? I'm intrigued by the privacy angle to this, seeing as VISA and Mastercard apparently share and/or sell a lot of transaction data with/to third parties. Edit: The article has been updated: As rumored, Apple is partnering with Goldman Sachs for Apple Ca…

I use Apple pay wherever possible. It is far quicker and more convenient than either cash, chip card or swipe in that order. Besides convenience, security and privacy are the backstop for my usage. I just trust Apple more to not be sleezy with my transaction history.

With the new Apple Card, somewhere in the presentation Apple had "Goldman Sachs will never sell your data to third parties" but what about the MasterCard backend? Surely, they'll see exact transactions and store information?

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#67

Post by ocdtrekkie » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

Most interesting claim is that there are no late fees. If you don't pay it on time, I presume they're going to stop letting you continue making charges to the card until you do? But that it never gets you locked into the debt cycle of so many other cards?

If true, this is the true real innovation.

Or is there interest, but just no fee for not making your payment on time?

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#68

Post by shoo_pl » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

jwagenet wrote: post #43

How does something like this work in Europe with no signature on the card? When I tried to use a US card without a PIN that I hadn't yet signed, a German checker made a fuss about the missing signature. This isn't a problem in the US where no one bothers checking the signature. What about a brewery I went to this weekend where neither swipe or chip was available for their POS and the card number was manually entered?

As they said, it only works where Apple Pay works already. And already Apple Pay works almost everywhere there is contactless terminal.

Some people say you will be able to see the card number in your Wallet app, but somehow I doubt it. There is already a unique card number for every physical card you added to your walled, but you cannot see it. You can verify it on proof of purchase where last 4 digits are shown - they will differ from your physical card.

As for signed/unsigned, it gets vague these days. In the past you were required by your bank agreement to sign your card. If you tried to pay with spouse card the merchant was allowed to call police and destroy the card right away.

Today probably are still required to do all that with physical card, but with contactless payments its usually ignored all the time.

For Apple Pay you must agree to different set of rules, those don't require you to physically sign anything as its fully digital. Same thing here.

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#69

Post by ignoramous » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

siculars wrote: post #34

ckastner wrote: post #4

> get a digital card that they can use anywhere Apple Pay Apply Pay users: how broad is Apply Pay adoption? Is this a viable replacement for a VISA, Mastercard or AMEX? I'm intrigued by the privacy angle to this, seeing as VISA and Mastercard apparently share and/or sell a lot of transaction data with/to third parties. Edit: The article has been updated: As rumored, Apple is partnering with Goldman Sachs for Apple Ca…

I use Apple pay wherever possible. It is far quicker and more convenient than either cash, chip card or swipe in that order. Besides convenience, security and privacy are the backstop for my usage. I just trust Apple more to not be sleezy with my transaction history.

Re: Privacy: Cash is the most privacy friendly payment method. Followed by virtual credit cards, which aren't really that private but an improvement over the usual.

Here with Apple Card, even if Apple might not choose to centralise your payment data, the underlying network (MasterCard, in this case) most certainly can know where you spent it, and vendors at point of sale can keep track of it too.

Re: Apple announces Apple Card credit card

#70

Post by dwighttk » Mon, Mar 25, 2019, 5:56 PM UTC

nabaraz wrote: post #25

With the rise of smartphone payments like Samsung Pay, Android Pay and Apple Pay , is there even a need for credit cards? How long until these companies start skipping payment processors like Visa and Mastercard and take the whole pie?

kinda like checks. Most people probably won't need them, but they can be useful in some circumstances.