Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

stallman.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 238 posts

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#61

Post by krapp »

robertAngst wrote: post #17
JimmyAustin wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman Stallman has been the leading proponent of software freedom for many, many decades. He isn't inherently against big corps, he is against what a lot of big corps do.

Can anyone on HN explain why software freedom could ever be a bad thing? IE: I only see it as Apple having extreme upfront costs, keeping poor people away from developing.

I don't see software freedom as a bad thing, I just disagree with the moralism of the free software philosophy. I don't believe there is an implicit moral dimension to software licensing, it's simply a matter of technical and financial tradeoffs.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#62

Post by pbalau »

JdeBP wrote: post #34

> If you carry a cell phone, it tells Big Brother where you are. It's worth remembering that if one carries a mobile telephone, and it is not fully powered off, TPC always knows where you are, and the powers that be do not need to go to Apple for that information. A mobile telephone broadcasts to let the world know where it is, and the mobile telephony system only works in the first place if the system knows how to r…

> the mobile telephony system only works in the first place if the system knows how to route incoming calls and SMS messages to a person's telephone

Like every other messaging system. Because you know, in order to send a message you need to know where...

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#63

Post by snazz »

mark_l_watson wrote: post #45

+1 Richard Sure, he is cherry picking examples, but there are a lot of examples to choose from. I used mostly Linux at home for about 15 years, then switched to a decade of MacOS. My new laptop is a Linux laptop and I think I will go back to Linux as my main driver. I am really conflicted about cellphones. I was unhappy with the crap ware preloaded on my Verizon Android phones. I am happier with a Verizon iPhone, as…

If your Android phone is compatible[0], you might enjoy the result from installing LineageOS on it. If you wish, you can continue to use the Google Play Services package (which is where Google does all the tracking, and is also the only way to get the Play Store). I chose not to and use F-Droid and directly downloaded APKs, which saves me from running any proprietary code that I haven’t vetted carefully.

It also solves the planned obsolescence issue, because my Galaxy S4 is screaming-fast on a version of Android from three years after its last manufacturer update.

[0]: https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#64

Post by altairiumblue »

tokyodude wrote: post #21
why_only_15 wrote: post #7

Apple doesn't really spy on users imo. Internally, the privacy team is quite powerful and forces lots of safeguards about how exactly data can be used.

Same with Google. Google has privacy teams as well which are > quite powerful and forces lots of safeguards about how exactly data can be used. Apple recommends apps based on other apps I've downloaded. So does Google. Apple recommends music based on other music I've played. So does Google. Apple recommends books and movies as well based on similar data. So does Google. Apple keeps track of every placed your Apple de…

Their incentives with regards to data are aligned differently - Apple make most of their revenue from selling hardware to their users, Google make most of their revenue from selling ads to someone different from their users.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#65

Post by talkingtab »

The #1 reason not to use Apple is their arrogance toward their users. I don't want them to lie to me about my battery, nor make me choose their music over spotify and engage in other customer-hostile policies to make money.

If it were only that simple, sigh. Google is much worse. Apple at least lip sync's privacy, I suspect when it is to their advantage.

I believe Apple just has no clue as to how to create products any more. How much money are they sitting on and and this is the best they can do?

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#66

Post by xondono »

johnchristopher wrote: post #42
azangru wrote: post #9

Most of the reasons in that list are ideological, not technical. I mean, I like listening to RMS, but prefer my choice of technology to be governed by technical reasons, not by what a company does in China or in Russia. Incidentally, given a choice between an Apple machine and a well-functioning GNU/Linux machine I would pick the latter.

Technology carry its own intrinsic political and ethical weight. Choosing a tech over another tech for technical reasons and ignoring other aspects is a political choice.

I’m seriously kind of tired of this argument.

We’ve gone from “not choosing is a choice” to “every choice is political”.

I’m sorry but the latter doesn’t immediatly follow from the first.

You can and are totally free to not use a technology or buy from a particular company for political reasons, but that does not mean that others are making a political choice when doing so.

Similarly you should argue that eating meat is a religious choice, since some religions prohibit meat consumption.

I find this kind of reasoning bogus at best.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#67

Post by throwawaymath »

tokyodude wrote: post #26
gowld wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's interesting about stallman is that he is zealous about his philosophy, but like all philosophies, his philosophy is inconsistent when you take it to its logical extremes. (See the paradox of closed source microwaves). Stallman's philosophy is a veneer over utilitarianism and assumption that the computer is a unique construct in society -- software should be libre because libre software provides the most value…

I know of no security benefits to closed platforms. I know many people believe one platform that happens to be closed, iOS, is more secure than some other platforms but I've seen no evidence that it's more secure because it's closed. In fact, the platform that's generally considered the least secure, Windows, is also closed.

The general argument is that iOS is more secure because Apple strictly controls both the hardware and the software. The two are very tightly integrated in Apple products, which means proprietary software for e.g. segregating userland or interacting with the secure enclave is specialized and well-audited.

The other (perhaps more compelling) argument is that Apple is only able to invest this level of security in its products because of its spectacular profits, which would likely be much lower if iOS were open source.

That's basically the gist of it.

EDIT: To whoeever downvoted this, I'm just relaying the argument.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#68

Post by heavenlyblue »

badpun wrote: post #48
viraptor wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some level - why not? Getting enough food not to starve shouldn't require having money. That's what food banks, soup kitchens, etc. are about. It doesn't mean luxury food, just like the public toilets are basic.

There are free public restrooms (at least in my country), which are equivalent of the soup kitchens in your example. What he's proposing though is to NEVER pay for the restroom, even if you can afford it - you should always look for free one instead. He hopes that this form of boycott, if it becomes popular enough, will convince toilet owners to not charge for the use. In the food context, it would mean always eating…

Stallman doesn’t propose not paying for the toilet.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#69

Post by dana321 »

Recent examples of why not to use apple:

1. Their new keyboards are terrible, and are buggy. 2. Lack of headphone jack on phones. 3. Vast price increases for relatively little new features. 4. Constant upgrading of the OS which breaks half of the software you use.

Re: Reasons Not to Use Apple (2018)

#70

Post by fwdpropaganda »

quantumcd wrote: post #58
tokyodude wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same with Google. Google has privacy teams as well which are > quite powerful and forces lots of safeguards about how exactly data can be used. Apple recommends apps based on other apps I've downloaded. So does Google. Apple recommends music based on other music I've played. So does Google. Apple recommends books and movies as well based on similar data. So does Google. Apple keeps track of every placed your Apple de…

Yeah, something I feel people (particularly who aren't in my normal tech-industry sphere) I hear discussing data privacy seem to think is that the data itself is being sold/shared with third parties. To be fair though, the concept of any sense of privacy from a service built on seemingly invading your privacy is a complex one to digest

You ate the whole "we don't sell/share data with third parties". They might not sell or share as usually defined, but they allows third parties to make decisions based on the data. And if you think about it, making decisions based on data is really the only value that data has. Please stop repeating their talking points.
Post reply on HN