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Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

timetoplayfair.com

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Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#61

Post by dbuder »

ChrisRR wrote: post #3

While I was ready to leave a comment about Spotify not playing fair with artists, I have seen Apple's unfair business practices first hand with developing apps and bluetooth devices. Unfortunately they are abusing their power, and are being flat out unfair if you want to develop a bluetooth device or app. If you want to vet apps to ensure a safe environment, that's fine, but these practices go beyond that and are unf…

What kind of issues did you run into developing BT devices? beyond them treating the spec like a rough draft of suggestions.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#62

Post by Blackbeard_ »

georgespencer wrote: post #44

Can someone help me stop playing the world's smallest violin here? Spotify knowingly built a low margin business living in the pocket of the labels (who force Spotify towards razor thin margins) and Apple/Google (who have, since before Spotify launched, operated app stores for their platforms which are to some extent curated and which are not free market economies). Spotify feels aggrieved that Apple does not allow i…

RE: Football

Monopolies can have negative effects without trying to extract monopoly rents.

The competition between BT and Sky massively increased the TV rights price for e.g. the premier league, so the clubs got much more money. In theory, they used this to buy better players etc and increase the quality of the league.

Although you now have to pay twice, the quality of the product has gone up. So it's not a zero-sum game. You can argue that you don't think it's worth it, but that's an opinion, it's not true that it's an inherently worse situation.

Until they entered into a rights sharing agreement.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#63

Post by cobookman »

fmo91 wrote: post #39
judah wrote: post #29

This exemplifies some of the reasons proprietary app store lock-in is bad for consumers. Progressive Web Apps -- web apps that are installable and available offline without any app store -- are a viable alternative, and ultimately a threat to Apple's app store racket. It's likely why iOS Safari continues to drag it's feet on PWA support.

I agree with that. However, what worries me about PWAs is discoverability. How can I find a catalog of available PWAs to download? Is there a way?

Google could easily come in here.

Note I work for Google but have no knowledge of Googles PWA products or PWA roadmap

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#64

Post by 5trokerac3 »

georgespencer wrote: post #44

Can someone help me stop playing the world's smallest violin here? Spotify knowingly built a low margin business living in the pocket of the labels (who force Spotify towards razor thin margins) and Apple/Google (who have, since before Spotify launched, operated app stores for their platforms which are to some extent curated and which are not free market economies). Spotify feels aggrieved that Apple does not allow i…

The difference comes in when Apple introduced Apple Music, a direct competitor to Spotify. So now, they're not only offering an essentially identical service, they're extracting a toll from their competition through their other holdings.

To put this in 19th century anti-trust terms, the manufacturing company owns the railways and charges the competition a toll to transport their goods. It's a clear cut case for Spotify, from a legal perspective.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#65

Post by georgespencer »

Blackbeard_ wrote: post #62
georgespencer wrote: post #44

Can someone help me stop playing the world's smallest violin here? Spotify knowingly built a low margin business living in the pocket of the labels (who force Spotify towards razor thin margins) and Apple/Google (who have, since before Spotify launched, operated app stores for their platforms which are to some extent curated and which are not free market economies). Spotify feels aggrieved that Apple does not allow i…

RE: Football Monopolies can have negative effects without trying to extract monopoly rents. The competition between BT and Sky massively increased the TV rights price for e.g. the premier league , so the clubs got much more money. In theory, they used this to buy better players etc and increase the quality of the league. Although you now have to pay twice, the quality of the product has gone up. So it's not a zero-su…

That's a really great point which I hadn't considered! Thanks.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#66

Post by saagarjha »

simongr3dal wrote: post #48
mcphage wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Apple deliberately leaves those features unbuilt in order to give itself a market position that others can't compete with There's a vast gulf between "Spotify was blocked" and "Apple didn't spend time and money building a service that Spotify wanted".

From a layman perspective: Why can Siri make Apple Music play artists, albums, playlists, and songs but I can't ask Siri to do the same with Spotify? Clearly the technology is there, but Apple is not letting Spotify use it.

Spotify should be able to do this using the API provided in iOS 12.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#67

Post by xrmagnum »

georgespencer wrote: post #44

Can someone help me stop playing the world's smallest violin here? Spotify knowingly built a low margin business living in the pocket of the labels (who force Spotify towards razor thin margins) and Apple/Google (who have, since before Spotify launched, operated app stores for their platforms which are to some extent curated and which are not free market economies). Spotify feels aggrieved that Apple does not allow i…

More than a decade ago, the EU forced Microsoft to let people choose their browser on a Windows machine with a fresh install. Not only that but the list of choices was randomly sorted so that IE would not be the first listed.

> Why do I have to allow you to develop software for my proprietary hardware, just because it's technically possible?

Of course if you were Apple, you would not want to do it. But, that’s what antitrust laws are for. As a consumer they are valuable: how long have people been waiting to use Spotify their Apple Watch?

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#68

Post by numair »

snaily wrote: post #59
numair wrote: post #17

Considering all of the dirty tricks and favoritism between Spotify and Facebook, I’m not sure they are the right messengers for this. Oh, and one of the early execs involved with Spotify told me, point blank, “that man needs to die already” in reference to Steve Jobs before his passing. Yeah, I was just as shocked as you might be in reading that. I doubt I was the only one aware of such dark sentiments. The executive…

This does not ring true to my experience. I was at the Spotify office the day the news of Steve's untimely death broke. It was a solemn day, and the the one senior executive I spoke to expressed true sorrow, as if a longtime friend had passed. Jobs was incredibly respected by the Spotify crew, as far as I'm concerned.

You’re talking about the rank and file, my friend. I’m talking about people who had billions of dollars on the line.

Re: Spotify to Apple: Time to Play Fair

#69

Post by rhinoceraptor »

owenwil wrote: post #4

The claims in here are pretty wild, particularly around how Apple has favored its own products: - Apple blocked Spotify from working with Apple Watch - It blocked Spotify from building apps for HomePod - It blocked Spotify from building apps for Siri - It blocks Spotify updates on a regular basis - It blocked Spotify from using a podcasting API after it acquired 2x major podcasting companies I genuinely hope Europe t…

I don't see how blocking a company actively trying to monopolize podcasts from using the Apple recommendation API is monopolistic. Apple podcasts (either intentionally or just from neglect) have always been backed by open RSS podcasting.
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