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How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

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Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#61

Post by mlthoughts2018 »

RDR2 starts out almost as an anti-game, then progresses through a phase that feels like a stereotype of old westerns. I think it jerks you between the two extremes to set up the second half of the game, which involves much more drama, racial overtones, and more examination of the death of outlaw life that the game’s promise is built on.

There are two main criticisms to me.

(1) the dialogue is very cheesy and superficial too often when it would be better to just not have it at all. More segments of deep sparsity, even when other characters are around you (think Shadow of the Collossus) would make it even more desolate and impactful.

(2) The mechanics of the controls and indicated special instructions are sometimes clunky to the point that you fail missions or miss out on things accidentally just due to the control system. I know this will never be perfect, but it is frequently so bad in RDR2 that you are very aware of it and frustrated by it as you complete tasks.

Despite this, it’s easily one of the best games I’ve ever played on multiple dimensions.

It makes me very excited for Death Stranding as well, which I think will be something of a sci-fi / dystopian variation of what RDR2 is.

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#62

Post by gms7777 »

barbecue_sauce wrote: post #51
abledon wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the Internet has quashed my enjoyment of single player games ... it’s like I gotta have a multiplayer competitive at all times , if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears , Meh who cares not fun haha

As a debilitatingly asocial person (even online), I have the complete opposite position. I dislike the industry shift towards games that focus on multiplayer and sometimes don't even have a single-player mode.

While there is definitely a focus on multiplayer games ($$$ drives all things), these last few years have also yielded some of the most incredible single-player games. Major studios are investing in AAA primarily single-player titles (from this year alone, God of War, Spiderman, RDR2, Assassin's Creed Odyssey) and there is also an explosion of high quality indie titles.

As someone that almost never plays online except some occasional co-op with friends, I don't feel one bit neglected by the current state of the industry.

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#63

Post by onlyfortoday2 »

mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #61

RDR2 starts out almost as an anti-game, then progresses through a phase that feels like a stereotype of old westerns. I think it jerks you between the two extremes to set up the second half of the game, which involves much more drama, racial overtones, and more examination of the death of outlaw life that the game’s promise is built on. There are two main criticisms to me. (1) the dialogue is very cheesy and superfic…

what exactly makes it one of the best games you have ever played?

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#64

Post by abledon »

ajmurmann wrote: post #41
nullstyle wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a unfortunate statement, as there are many reasons to game. I'm guessing you havent really spent much time gaming. For me, the most important part of gaming for me is sharing time with my far-flung-friends. We're not watching a tree fall, we're building a campfire together. Sharing GTA5's space with 7 friends is much better than a group video call with the same crowd, for example. Acknowledgment from others d…

Unfortunately I've spent a lot of time gaming. Not much online with friends though. At least not in recent years. You make a very valid point that sounds entirely different than OP's "tree falling in the forest" argument.

Yeah I think I was more getting at the 5 axis of game design, there’s people who’d like to : Explore, Socialize. Challenge based game / rankings , Strategy / logic, Forget other one

I’d say my tree falling in forest remark goes along two axis of social + challenge against other human brain . Almost same dopamine hit of telling a joke and getting reaction from crowd, feels fun to tell jokes similar to goofing off in multiplayer games etc

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#65

Post by abledon »

Merad wrote: post #54
abledon wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel the Internet has quashed my enjoyment of single player games ... it’s like I gotta have a multiplayer competitive at all times , if a tree falls in the forest and no one hears , Meh who cares not fun haha

So your own enjoyment of a game is meaningless unless someone knows you're enjoying it? I suppose that's your prerogative, but it sounds like we play games for different reasons.

No more like I enjoy knowing two or more human brains are collaborating on the same real-time experience

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#66

Post by mlthoughts2018 »

onlyfortoday2 wrote: post #63
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #61

RDR2 starts out almost as an anti-game, then progresses through a phase that feels like a stereotype of old westerns. I think it jerks you between the two extremes to set up the second half of the game, which involves much more drama, racial overtones, and more examination of the death of outlaw life that the game’s promise is built on. There are two main criticisms to me. (1) the dialogue is very cheesy and superfic…

what exactly makes it one of the best games you have ever played?

Several things.

The scale of technical achievement is by far more impressive than anything that came before. Metal Gear Solid 5 might be the closest thing in terms of open world technology, but RDR2 is far superior to it.

The anti-game aspects create a very different dramatic experience than most games. Sometimes you just ride along with another character and do nothing but observe what happens. Other times your plans get derailed in an Inception sort of way and you end up halfway acrosd the map doing something you never intended, none of which has anything to do with the story. This happens in ways that are much more organic and natural than previous similar mechanisms in e.g. GTA games.

The story deals with a lot of themes that have more impact because of coming across them in an open world (stumbling into KKK meetings, seeing lynched bodies hanging in swamplands, tracking down a gang that tortures animals, finding evidence of families split by slave trade, and many more).

The main story is compelling and well crafted, but the fuller picture from the pastiche of stuff in the world makes it feel effective, and the scenes of blood-thirsty wild west action feel more like uncommon punctuation marks than important aspects of the plot.

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#67

Post by cpeterso »

corysama wrote: post #57

If you like this, you can find more at https://www.reddit.com/r/TheMakingOfGames/

GDC posts videos of game postmortem presentations from the games' developers, including classic games like Bard's Tale and Another World:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL2e4mYbwSTbbiX2uwspn0...

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#68

Post by atom-morgan »

empath75 wrote: post #27

I’m sort of ambivalent about the game and it’s largely because I have two young kids at home and have maybe an hour at a time to play and the amount of what I would call ‘empty’ time in the game really stands out. There have been times where I’ve done all the work I need to do to get some unbroken alone time, spent 40 minutes playing and gotten absolute nothing accomplished which really sucks given that it might be t…

I'm not even a dad and this game sucks for the reasons you mentioned.

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#69

Post by stevehiehn »

onlyfortoday2 wrote: post #63
mlthoughts2018 wrote: post #61

RDR2 starts out almost as an anti-game, then progresses through a phase that feels like a stereotype of old westerns. I think it jerks you between the two extremes to set up the second half of the game, which involves much more drama, racial overtones, and more examination of the death of outlaw life that the game’s promise is built on. There are two main criticisms to me. (1) the dialogue is very cheesy and superfic…

what exactly makes it one of the best games you have ever played?

I would say it's the best game I've ever played because the aesthetics are so amazing I actually feel compelled to 'roleplay'. I've played lots of games classified as role playing but really I'm always just working the mechanics. In RD2 I sometimes turn on the game just to go for a horse ride or go fishing regardless of whether or not it's contributing to objective progress.

Re: How the West Was Digitized: The Making of Rockstar Games’ Red Dead Redemption 2

#70

Post by woolvalley »

pier25 wrote: post #46
TimesOldRoman wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm still on Witcher 3. Hopefully it will last until Cyberpunk 2077..

The other day I saw that hour long gameplay video 2077 and it was mesmerizing. I can't wait to play it, will probably even upgrade my PC just for that game, but OTOH the world looks so immersive and deep I fear that I'd need a couple of weeks off.

I bet 2077 will be a next generation console headliner, so you don't necessarily need to buy a $500 video card to play it :)
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