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Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

arstechnica.com

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Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#61

Post by xienze »

Svexav wrote: post #31
carlesfe wrote: post #13

Apple are paving the way to A-chip laptops, not only by building excellent tech, but also PR-wise. Their last keynote was clearly a gymnastics exercise to ignore Intel CPUs and dismiss laptop performance while later praising their own chips which power a tablet that has no software ready to use that much speed. The fact that one of the most secretive companies executes a PR-stunt by providing an exclusive interview t…

Why does it have to be a laptop? What not an iPhone with a desktop mode you can pair with a monitor, keyboard, and trackpad? I’d love the ability to carry all my software and data around in a phone without lugging around a laptop or having to buy a desktop computer. And I’d love to never concern myself with transferring or syncing data again. And why not let us connect an iPhone to an eGPU for desktop gaming?

>What not an iPhone with a desktop mode you can pair with a monitor, keyboard, and trackpad?

Because that would mean Apple doesn’t get to sell you two devices.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#62

Post by yurishimo »

theluketaylor wrote: post #28
carlesfe wrote: post #13

Apple are paving the way to A-chip laptops, not only by building excellent tech, but also PR-wise. Their last keynote was clearly a gymnastics exercise to ignore Intel CPUs and dismiss laptop performance while later praising their own chips which power a tablet that has no software ready to use that much speed. The fact that one of the most secretive companies executes a PR-stunt by providing an exclusive interview t…

The near total lack of the word "intel" at the keynote was certainly quite noticeable. The question is how much was that a negotiating ploy for better pricing/stock with intel and how much was positioning for arm macs. I think a bit of both. I went back to remind myself of the details of the switch from powerpc to intel. It was announced at wwdc 2005 (june) when they released a developer transition kit. The announcem…

Just curious, but how would custom silicon work with something like gaming engines? I know there are engines out there that support an ARM architecture, but as it is currently, you can run a lot of games fairly easily on Macs. And with eGPUs being officially supported now, gaming on a Mac is not a terrible experience.

Would moving off of traditional desktop CPUs harm that? Is there a way to do compatibility at the OS level without sacrificing half of the performance gains?

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#63

Post by threeseed »

bitwize wrote: post #48
gambiting wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>What not an iPhone with a desktop mode you can pair with a monitor, keyboard, and trackpad? That sounds like the most un-apple thing I can possibly imagine. Their ethos was always to build a device that does something incredibly well - a phone that can be a phone but also a desktop computer is everything but this.

ISTR seeing illustrations from an Apple patent showing a computer display with a slot in the back into which an iPhone can be docked, turning the phone into a full-size desktop workstation. And this was during the Jobs era.

Apple pays their employees to file patents for pretty much anything.

That doesn't mean they will ever manifest in real products.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#64

Post by threeseed »

tambourine_man wrote: post #49
theluketaylor wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The near total lack of the word "intel" at the keynote was certainly quite noticeable. The question is how much was that a negotiating ploy for better pricing/stock with intel and how much was positioning for arm macs. I think a bit of both. I went back to remind myself of the details of the switch from powerpc to intel. It was announced at wwdc 2005 (june) when they released a developer transition kit. The announcem…

I really like and share your vision for the Mac line, but I doubt keeping two instruction sets simultaneously is the Apple way. I hope I’m wrong though.

They've had dual instruction sets almost continuously since the company began:

MOS/68k, 68k/PowerPC, PowerPC/Intel, Intel/ARM

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#65

Post by theluketaylor »

scarface74 wrote: post #58
theluketaylor wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

iPad, especially with the limitations artificially imposed by iOS is a content consumption device first. You can trick it into other tasks, but it's not a primary computer. If I was apple I wouldn't go all in on arm macs. I'd build arm thin and light laptops to get incredible battery life and leave the pro line as x86 for at least the next 3+ years. Even if I did decide to stop building new x86 devices I'd support ma…

From an OS standpoint. I only see two real limitations keeping iOS from being a desktop replacement for most people -- support for mice/trackpads and adding support for USB Mass storage devices to the Files app and treating mass storage devices like they treat Dropbox/iCloud/OneDrive, etc.

iOS is getting close to being all the computer my grandparents could ever need. My mother as well. My father and I are both in tech and would run into too many hard (and fairly artificial) limitations pretty quickly.

I won't ever switch my primary computer to something that needs an optional accessory to hold the screen up. ipad may be magical, but there is plenty of wonder left in a device can open up and start typing on a real keyboard immediately. It's been many years since my primary computer has been a desktop, but I'm not willing to compromise on the permanently attached keyboard and freedom to decide what executes.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#66

Post by threeseed »

iagooar wrote: post #56

This is nuts. The iPad Pro is so massively ahead of the game, it's even hard to believe. It is faster than the MBP 2017 and ALMOST as fast as the MBP 2018. We're talking a device that is 5.9mm thick and is battery-powered! Now here's my prediction: Apple does not really want to build an ARM-powered MBP. Instead, they will eventually allow iPads to double boot into iOS and/or MacOS. Call me crazy, but this would be hu…

This will never, ever happen.

You can't use OSX with your finger. There are millions of places across the OS and applications where the hit point is too small for a finger. You just need to compare the keys on the iOS keyboard and then compare that to the traffic lights on OSX.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#67

Post by bsder »

camillomiller wrote: post #37
Svexav wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does it have to be a laptop? What not an iPhone with a desktop mode you can pair with a monitor, keyboard, and trackpad? I’d love the ability to carry all my software and data around in a phone without lugging around a laptop or having to buy a desktop computer. And I’d love to never concern myself with transferring or syncing data again. And why not let us connect an iPhone to an eGPU for desktop gaming?

Look up what Tim Cook thinks about convergence. That is not what an iPhone is for. Period. This gimmick is just a pipedream of us nerds. It won't have the slightest chance in the market and it would be a subpar product. Both Huawei and Samsung have implemented such a solution on their flagship smartphones since at least two years. They work as advertised, but nobody could give half a shit about them.

> Both Huawei and Samsung have implemented such a solution on their flagship smartphones since at least two years. They work as advertised, but nobody could give half a shit about them.

That's more a reflection of the fact that Samsung and Huawei suck at software--Bixby, anyone?

Everybody said the same thing about WiFi.

I used WiFi when it first came out--PCMCIA cards, external stick on antennas, etc. Worked as advertised but nobody gave a shit about them---until you sat in front of somebody and used it. It was almost a virus and spread like one.

Then everybody gave a shit. And look where we are now.

Everything on your phone--everywhere--is the endgame.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#68

Post by josteink »

AceJohnny2 wrote: post #34

I found Rob Beschizza's thought [1] about the new iPad Pro insightful: "a very powerful machine, handicapped by iOS having no workflow". Because of the sandboxed nature of iOS, and the current immaturity of the Files app/feature, it's hard and inconsistent how you can exchange files between apps on the iPad. As a result, you're still mostly stuck to using one app to do things in iOS. The workflow is still fragmented.…

So basically the same kind of argument which has plagued all high end Android tablets: Good hardware held back by lacking software.

Iow: If you want a pc, get a pc.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#69

Post by theluketaylor »

ryacko wrote: post #60
scarface74 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From an OS standpoint. I only see two real limitations keeping iOS from being a desktop replacement for most people -- support for mice/trackpads and adding support for USB Mass storage devices to the Files app and treating mass storage devices like they treat Dropbox/iCloud/OneDrive, etc.

And that iPads + keyboard are significantly cheaper than MacBooks.

Cheaper yes. Significantly? Not so sure. Unlike iphone apple hasn't been selling the old ipad pro as a cheaper, more entry level product. The base price of ipad pro has gone up each time we've seen an updated one until now we're firmly in macbook price land once you get functional storage. The modifier-free macbook is a similar size to 12.9 inch ipad pro, but ipad is actually more once you get 256 gb of storage and the optional keyboard.

Re: Apple walks Ars through the iPad Pro’s A12X system on a chip

#70

Post by Someone »

camillomiller wrote: post #37
Svexav wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does it have to be a laptop? What not an iPhone with a desktop mode you can pair with a monitor, keyboard, and trackpad? I’d love the ability to carry all my software and data around in a phone without lugging around a laptop or having to buy a desktop computer. And I’d love to never concern myself with transferring or syncing data again. And why not let us connect an iPhone to an eGPU for desktop gaming?

Look up what Tim Cook thinks about convergence. That is not what an iPhone is for. Period. This gimmick is just a pipedream of us nerds. It won't have the slightest chance in the market and it would be a subpar product. Both Huawei and Samsung have implemented such a solution on their flagship smartphones since at least two years. They work as advertised, but nobody could give half a shit about them.

”Look up what Tim Cook thinks about convergence”

You can’t look up what he thinks, only what he says he thinks.

Apple would be stupid if they wouldn’t be researching this option just in case. If they ever manage to make it work well, you can be sure what Cook says he thinks about convergence will change overnight.

For those who need more convincing: look up what Steve Jobs said he thought about products Apple didn’t ship, and compare it with what he said he thought about them later, when Apple _did_ ship them)

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