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Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

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Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#61

Post by antidesitter »

gaius wrote: post #52
antidesitter wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, what? Stop being vague and describe exactly what you mean. Response to edit: Please describe the full calculation (with factual numbers) of "national wealth", and then we'll talk.

LOL if you wish to disprove me do your own research! But I'll give you a hint, if tax evasion was good for a country, why would that country have taxes at all...?

> LOL if you wish to disprove me do your own research!

That's not how burden of proof works. You made the claim that "the country would literally be better off if those people were unemployed!", so prove it.

> But I'll give you a hint, if tax evasion was good for a country, why would that country have taxes at all...?

A "hint" is not what's required here.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#62

Post by vetinari »

rusk wrote: post #51
digianarchist wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ireland have already been given some lucky charms by the EU. For example, they were given permission to set their corporate taxes to a ridiculously low 12.5%.

Spoken like somebody who knows very little about the topic. The effective tax rate is far lower than this, but also, most countries have an effective tax rate for megacorps far lower than what they advertise once exemptions, subsidies and tax-breaks come into play.

The difference is, that the Irish rate applies to any business taxing its income in Ireland. It doesn't have to be a megacorp, they do not have to have special relations to get subsidies or tax breaks. It may be your company, if your registered and operate it there.

That's not the case in other EU countries.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#63

Post by kawsper »

Lio wrote: post #5
7000skeletons wrote: post #2

I didn't even need to click the link to know that Ireland was gonna be one of the three. It's like they have a vested interest, or something.

Yes they're an obvious one. I was surprised though that Luxembourg wasn't listed whist Sweden and Denmark are. I'd be interested to here their objects if anyone can point at a fuller article or discussion of the issues.

Both Apple and Facebook have announced that they are opening datacenters in Denmark, so that might be part of the equation.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#64

Post by TorKlingberg »

mabbo wrote: post #26
7000skeletons wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is from earlier this year, so the debate may have progressed since then, but Sweden and Denmarks' concerns seem to stem from the way in which the EU aims to apply the tax. >“A digital services tax deviates from fundamental principles of income taxation by applying the tax on gross income, i.e. without regard to whether the taxpayer is making a profit or not,” Swedish Finance Minister Magdalena Andersson, and her…

It's an intriguing concept. What effect would a tax purely on size (income rather than profit) have on the world economy, if everyone were to adopt such policies? It would discourage large companies and encourage small ones. It seems like employees do better when there is a bigger and more diverse marketplace for work, ie, many smaller companies. So they would win out, hopefully. Customers may or may not do better. I…

The opposite: It would encourage larger companies, because trade between companies is taxed but not "trade" within a company.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#65

Post by rusk »

rusk wrote: post #51
digianarchist wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ireland have already been given some lucky charms by the EU. For example, they were given permission to set their corporate taxes to a ridiculously low 12.5%.

Spoken like somebody who knows very little about the topic. The effective tax rate is far lower than this, but also, most countries have an effective tax rate for megacorps far lower than what they advertise once exemptions, subsidies and tax-breaks come into play.

That's not to mention the impact that the US tax system has allowing megacorps defer and arbitrate their tax obligations, which effectively lets them pay even less than that

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#67

Post by stickfigure »

mabbo wrote: post #26
7000skeletons wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is from earlier this year, so the debate may have progressed since then, but Sweden and Denmarks' concerns seem to stem from the way in which the EU aims to apply the tax. >“A digital services tax deviates from fundamental principles of income taxation by applying the tax on gross income, i.e. without regard to whether the taxpayer is making a profit or not,” Swedish Finance Minister Magdalena Andersson, and her…

It's an intriguing concept. What effect would a tax purely on size (income rather than profit) have on the world economy, if everyone were to adopt such policies? It would discourage large companies and encourage small ones. It seems like employees do better when there is a bigger and more diverse marketplace for work, ie, many smaller companies. So they would win out, hopefully. Customers may or may not do better. I…

It would not select against size. It would select against low margins.

Google and Apple would be fine. Amazon would be toast. Your local supermarket would be toast (avg grocery store margins are 1%). Any startups that are just scraping by, no matter how small, would be toast.

You would basically crank up the difficulty level of business across the board. This would generally help successful incumbents by making life punishingly difficult for challengers, who have to climb up through a period of unprofitability.

It is a terrible idea.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#68

Post by ElBarto »

ThomPete wrote: post #34

Denmark is a taxhaven in its own sense for holding companies which might be surprising to many. The country primarily tax income not companies and have a high (deductible for companies) sales tax.

The Danish corporate tax rate is within the EU average.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#69

Post by dbdjfjrjvebd »

richardwhiuk wrote: post #55
friedman23 wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A better solution would be to implement stricter accounting standards across the EU so that such tax dodges wouldn't be possible. This would solve the actual problem.

So they setup a business outside of the EU's jurisdiction and move the profit their? So all of the business in the EU is done at net no revenue (sales - costs - 'licensing fees' == 0). What accounting standard means that business is making a profit in the EU?

You could apply a tarrif on the licensing fees? This might upset the WTO.

Re: Three European Countries Block Tax on Tech Giants

#70

Post by rusk »

vetinari wrote: post #62
rusk wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spoken like somebody who knows very little about the topic. The effective tax rate is far lower than this, but also, most countries have an effective tax rate for megacorps far lower than what they advertise once exemptions, subsidies and tax-breaks come into play.

The difference is, that the Irish rate applies to any business taxing its income in Ireland. It doesn't have to be a megacorp, they do not have to have special relations to get subsidies or tax breaks. It may be your company, if your registered and operate it there. That's not the case in other EU countries.

The difference is, that the Irish rate applies

Speaking as an Irish resident, I can tell you that this is effectively untrue. Indigenous businesses, or even businesses small enough to not get the sweetheart treatment of the relevant authorities definitely do not get equal treatment. The difference is vast.

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