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The Awful German Language (1880)

cs.utah.edu

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Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#61

Post by krylon »

Koshkin wrote: post #34

German is an amazing, beautiful language. With not much of the vocabulary borrowed from other languages, words actually make sense. From that perspective, German can be seen as the modern equivalent of Latin, and if I were to choose only one language to remain on the entire planet, it would be German (sorry English, Chinese and Spanish). Its sounds are easier for non-native speakers to pronounce - especially compared…

As a German, allow me to respectfully disagree. I think English is far easier to learn. I often find it easier to express my thoughts in English than in German.

I do agree that German is a beautiful language, though, and highly recommend reading Nietzsche's Thus Spake Zarathustra to anyone who does or does not agree with me on this one.

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#62

Post by man-and-laptop »

Koshkin wrote: post #34

German is an amazing, beautiful language. With not much of the vocabulary borrowed from other languages, words actually make sense. From that perspective, German can be seen as the modern equivalent of Latin, and if I were to choose only one language to remain on the entire planet, it would be German (sorry English, Chinese and Spanish). Its sounds are easier for non-native speakers to pronounce - especially compared…

You could say the same thing about Russian. Like German, it doesn't borrow very heavily from other languages; and a lot of the words are simple variations of each other with different prefixes and suffixes. It was even the Lingua Franca (or "Latin") of the Communist bloc.

On the other hand, Russian might be an even harder language to learn than German, given that it's Slavic and uses a different alphabet. There's always Esperanto, which has more than 200,000 articles on Wikipedia; more than Latin even.

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#63

Post by rolleiflex »

amelius wrote: post #52
tannhaeuser wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know about your example, but Germans tend to pack more information into a sentence, particularly in the written form (as Mark Twain rightfully noticed). Actually, I find English somewhat clumsy to write technical documentation in. Using short sentences, I frequently end up in restating things and having to find alternative words and idioms to avoid repetition. Moreover, using relative clause in English isn't qu…

What I like about English is that it naturally supports gender neutrality. For example: "the user should upload their photo, and then they should press enter", instead of "the user should upload his/her photo and then he/she should press enter".

English still has he / she, so it’s not fully gender neutral, it still has gendered constructs in its ‘runtime’. There are a few fully gender neutral languages, Turkish is one.

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#64

Post by KeyboardFire »

bitL wrote: post #43
Koshkin wrote: post #34

German is an amazing, beautiful language. With not much of the vocabulary borrowed from other languages, words actually make sense. From that perspective, German can be seen as the modern equivalent of Latin, and if I were to choose only one language to remain on the entire planet, it would be German (sorry English, Chinese and Spanish). Its sounds are easier for non-native speakers to pronounce - especially compared…

Despite appearance, German is very illogical language full of idioms and exceptions one has to master. Also, even natives usually don't master the full extent of language and the overbearing nature of language with its need for precise use of words/formulations specific to a given situation often leads to strong reliance on syntax/appearance of complexity. You can see it in typical German philosophy, where the langua…

The idea that language limits or constrains the way people think (the stronger side of the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis) is now largely discredited by the majority of linguists.

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#65

Post by ravitation »

amelius wrote: post #52
tannhaeuser wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't know about your example, but Germans tend to pack more information into a sentence, particularly in the written form (as Mark Twain rightfully noticed). Actually, I find English somewhat clumsy to write technical documentation in. Using short sentences, I frequently end up in restating things and having to find alternative words and idioms to avoid repetition. Moreover, using relative clause in English isn't qu…

What I like about English is that it naturally supports gender neutrality. For example: "the user should upload their photo, and then they should press enter", instead of "the user should upload his/her photo and then he/she should press enter".

The various forms of singular 'they' are not exactly well/broadly accepted in written English...

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#66

Post by louisswiss »

mitchty wrote: post #3

Heh, its honestly not that bad of a language, and has undergone two reforms (maybe 3? I forget) since this document was created. The "awful" parts of German are in some ways its saving grace. Example: surfing is Wellenreiten, literally wave-riding or riding waves. This whole thing is all over German with compound words. Its really no different conceptually from "the old blue car" in English, its just mashed together…

Those aren't the awful parts though, really.

I would do away with the 'formal' form of addressing people (Germans have two ways of saying 'you') which serves no real purpose.

I'd also get rid of gendered articles and finally simplify word endings (adjective endings can go for a start)!

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#67

Post by sarabande »

codazoda wrote: post #51
Koshkin wrote: post #34

German is an amazing, beautiful language. With not much of the vocabulary borrowed from other languages, words actually make sense. From that perspective, German can be seen as the modern equivalent of Latin, and if I were to choose only one language to remain on the entire planet, it would be German (sorry English, Chinese and Spanish). Its sounds are easier for non-native speakers to pronounce - especially compared…

I took 4 years of German in high school, so I'm no expert, but I do disagree about it making sense any more than any other language. There are at least 3 ways to say "the". Der, die, and das. Which one you use depends on if the object you're talking about is femanine or not. To top that off some geographic areas use "das" for everything. It also has words that are similar to English; toilette (toilet) and hast (have)…

Curious, what geographic regions are you referring to?

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#68

Post by louisswiss »

noonespecial wrote: post #32
simonmales wrote: post #16

As a foreigner living and working in Germany for a number a years, reading succinct explanations of German grammar is actually quite refreshing. Personally, grammatical concepts in English for me are quite challenging. Now try and learn a language that has complex grammar rules when you don't _actually_ know your own rules is quite imitating.

Same here. German always follows the rules. You might not like the rules, but it always follows the rules!

Until it doesn't.

Is it das Nutella or die Nutella?

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#69

Post by louisswiss »

KeyboardFire wrote: post #64
bitL wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite appearance, German is very illogical language full of idioms and exceptions one has to master. Also, even natives usually don't master the full extent of language and the overbearing nature of language with its need for precise use of words/formulations specific to a given situation often leads to strong reliance on syntax/appearance of complexity. You can see it in typical German philosophy, where the langua…

The idea that language limits or constrains the way people think (the stronger side of the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis) is now largely discredited by the majority of linguists.

I've long thought it a real possibility that people are constrained (in certain areas) by their language.

No expert and not disagreeing with you, but I'd be very interested to read any literature you can recommend on the subject.

Re: The Awful German Language (1880)

#70

Post by pitaj »

zwieback wrote: post #41

I'm German but have been living in the US for 25 yrs and my verdict is that the German grammar is overly and unnecessarily complicated. The pronunciation, on the other hand, is sane, which cannot be said of English.

It's not English pronunciation that's wrong, it's the spelling.
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