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What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

freemovement.org.uk

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Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#61

Post by tssva »

comex wrote: post #45
Someone1234 wrote: post #22

I have experience with both the UK and US immigration systems. I agree, it is very easy with how complicated the processes can be to make mistakes, even seemingly big ones, just by misunderstanding a single requirement. Even non-immigration lawyers make serious errors. > Lucas made his application for naturalisation on 14 May 2014, a couple of weeks before the expiry of his visa. I'm playing devil's advocate here, bu…

> Essentially the article is complaining that the other applicants that applied before him were processed before him. Only if you assume that the Home Office's capacity is fixed. I don't know any of the details myself, but presumably they could have avoided creating such long backlog by hiring more employees.

Since the Home Office is a government agency which operates on a fixed budget it is unlikely they can just hire more employees as the number of applications rises. They can request a budget increase for the following year so they can hire more employees then, but the decision to approve the request is a political one outside of their hands.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#62

Post by shripadk »

While the Home Office in UK was vigorously trying its best to throw Lucas out, the same Home Office in UK is trying its best to keep economic offenders like Vijay Mallya and Lalit Modi from being deported: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/04/28/india-asks-brita...

"The Home Office said the suspension of Mr Mallya's passport was a matter for Indian authorities and declined to comment on the individual case, citing its policy of neither confirming nor denying if any extradition request has been received until an arrest is made."

It's been 2 years since India sent a formal extradition request. It has been rejected twice.

Just to explain the absolute ridiculousness of this entire exercise to those who aren't aware: The case is still pending in UK court and the defence is actually arguing about the cleanliness of Indian jails and if adequate toilet facilities are provided for a fugitive:

https://www.business-standard.com/article/current-affairs/gi...

With this action of the Home Office, it has been made abundantly clear that the "human rights" of an economic fugitive far outweighs the human rights of Lucas.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#63

Post by [deleted] »

mmsimanga wrote: post #40

I speak as an immigrant. I see a lot of comments not being too kind to people who aren't welcoming of immigrants. As a person, I actually do understand. Not everyone is going to like me. As an African I do wish some of this energy would be directed to the African leaders that make their countries so terrible that someone feels it is better to jump on a rickety boat in search of a better life. These African "leaders"…

[deleted]

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#64

Post by dogma1138 »

curiousgal wrote: post #57

> "indefinite leave to remain" My brain breaks whenever I read this. Like who the fuck came up with this name?

Leave means permission, going on leave means you go with permission and why AWOL stands for absence without leave.

“Old English lēaf ‘permission’, of West Germanic origin; related to lief and love.”

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#65

Post by lsd5you »

mmsimanga wrote: post #40

I speak as an immigrant. I see a lot of comments not being too kind to people who aren't welcoming of immigrants. As a person, I actually do understand. Not everyone is going to like me. As an African I do wish some of this energy would be directed to the African leaders that make their countries so terrible that someone feels it is better to jump on a rickety boat in search of a better life. These African "leaders"…

No doubt there are terrible leaders, but experience in the middle east has shown it's no just terrible leaders standing in the way of prosperity.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#66

Post by ethbro »

nutjob2 wrote: post #25
pavlov wrote: post #14

Anti-immigration people in various countries often argue that they just want to prevent “bad ones” coming in, they’re not looking to throw out the “good ones”. The reality is that there’s no leniency for perceived good immigrants as these people imagine, and it’s just getting worse as immigration policies are tightened across Europe. Officials are under pressure to refuse as many applications as they can, and it’s ea…

This is not Europe wide. I have current and first hand experience of two EU countries in this regard and nothing has changed in the last couple of years. In any system mistakes are made on both sides of an application and most countries have reasonable systems to resolve them, but in the case of the UK authorities, they are no longer acting in good faith.

> no longer acting in good faith

This seems to be the greatest legal casualty of anti-immigrant rhetoric -- cover for bureaucratic apathy.

Maybe the author of the initial decision acted with malicious intent.

But I'd bet they just didn't care and certified it that way so as to not have the case boomerang back to them. And the political climate gave them flexibility to do so.

The only defense against this seems like a more robust, independent version of a Dean of Students, albeit for everyone interfacing with the legal system. Empowered to bring action against egregious ethical or moral breaches.

The legal profession seems to have no inclination to weed out those lacking ethical standards, so tragedies like Aaron Schwartz go unpunished. Carmen Ortiz, who oversaw the prosecution as US A, now practices law in the private sector. [1]

I get that handling lots of cases with limited resources is difficult. But when you fuck up, and then insist you were right rather than act with some compassion? There should be consequences.

[1] http://www.andersonkreiger.com/attorney/carmen-m-ortiz/

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#67

Post by atemerev »

personjerry wrote: post #3

I don’t think the government did anything wrong; The rules aren’t meant to be bent, and if Lucas made a mistake in filing the wrong paperwork, it absolutely makes sense for the consequences to follow. In these serious legal matters, you need to seek counsel. This article attempts to paint a picture of the poor child, but the law was clear, and any emotional appeal should be invalid.

Not everything that is legal is right, and illegal is wrong.

In many countries, being gay is illegal. In some countries, being a woman and walking alone in the street is illegal. “Oh, but they have to respect the law” is a poor defense.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#68

Post by [deleted] »

jwilk wrote: post #39

What a weird submission title ("Mistakenly apply for British citizenship instead of indefinite leave to remain"). The original title ("What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship instead of indefinite leave to remain?") is probably too long for HN, but I'd rather shorten it to: "What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?"

[deleted]

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#69

Post by mmsimanga »

tinktank wrote: post #60
mmsimanga wrote: post #40

I speak as an immigrant. I see a lot of comments not being too kind to people who aren't welcoming of immigrants. As a person, I actually do understand. Not everyone is going to like me. As an African I do wish some of this energy would be directed to the African leaders that make their countries so terrible that someone feels it is better to jump on a rickety boat in search of a better life. These African "leaders"…

It's much easier to hate on an individual in front of you than a president, policy, regime or country (and takes less effort). The bigger grind for me is that the same countries (UK in particular) hammering citizens from those countries welcome leaders with open arms and provide them with refuge, the ability to buy sheltered properties etc. The UKG loves nothing or nobody but money, I just wish they would be upfront…

100% with you. At some point, someone has to ask who/what is causing the immigrants. I know the answer isn't simple. Some will even say the West is caused all the issues in the first place. At some point though we have to start discussing concrete ways of changing the status quos and moving forward. Changing UK immigration laws might help a few of us get into the UK but not much will change in the home country. The same African dictators rigging elections are allowed to vote on UN resolutions and make grandstanding speeches at global conventions.

Re: What happens if you mistakenly apply for British citizenship?

#70

Post by ngcazz »

ppod wrote: post #50
nutjob2 wrote: post #20

This is par for the course in the UK right now. The Tories have been pandering to the xenophobes and racists for some time now an their "hostile environment" for immigrants isn't restricted to ones who are doing something illegal, instead it seems to be targeted toward making life miserable, if not impossible for any immigrants wether they're doing the right thing or not. They have no problems breaking their own rule…

Look at this poll: https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/docume... The voters of all parties support these policies. What is "pandering" in a democracy? The people are xenophobes, they are getting what they want.

I think you're both right, pandering is opposed to leading (and eventually shaping public opinion in a non-nefarious fashion).
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