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E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

washingtonpost.com

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Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#61

Post by DoctorOetker »

gambiting wrote: post #49
unethical_ban wrote: post #6

This is one of the most unabashedly sinister first-world articles I've read in a while. Microsoft's argument hinges on two damages: Either, they didn't get to charge a convenience fee to customers, or they were losing revenue by people unexpectedly extending the life of their computers. Foolish judges and evil lawyers putting a decent person away for 13 months.

>> The judge said he disregarded Weadock’s testimony. “I don’t think anybody in that courtroom understood what a restore disk was,” Lundgren said. There's the problem.

I think Lundgrens analysis is closer to the truth:

“I got in the way of their agenda,” Lundgren said, “this profit model that’s way more profitable than I could ever be.”

On average judges defend the nation, money must flow up. The nation's tax income on Microsofts exploitation are bigger (or so thinks the judge) than the tax income on Lundger's (preventive) recycling business.

Your taxes represent your bullying/fleecing strength. When one tithe collector gets in an argument with another tithe collector, the goverment tends to agree with the tithe collector that brings the biggest tithes...

The population needs to be fleeced. The natural order of things and so on. So it is!

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#62

Post by pc86 »

fuball63 wrote: post #34
dingaling wrote: post #3

I'm in two minds over this. First, it's ridiculous that someone is being jailed for 15 months for trying to make it easier to keep using older PCs and reducing waste. On the other hand that's the risk one takes when dabbling in the world of proprietary software. Where discouraging people from upgrading is seen as a threat to revenue and is attacked accordingly. Had he printed 34,000 Linux disks we'd never have had th…

My first response was "he should have used linux", but I came to a similar conclusion as you. People are scared of linux, despite it now being almost as easy as Windows to install/use for typical usage. E-waste is the result of computer transitioning from the role of "tool" to role of "disposable consumer good". The effort to provide people with the ability to easily repair their machines to a familiar state (being W…

Well the entire goal of this operation was to allow people to continue using their old Windows computers. The same people who are taking them in to physical stores to be refreshed, since that was the original customer for the disks. In that instance "just use Linux" is not an available option.

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#63

Post by PeterisP »

pweissbrod wrote: post #44
Hasz wrote: post #14

From the article "“These sales of counterfeit operating systems,” Microsoft lawyer Bonnie MacNaughton wrote to the judge, “displaced Microsoft’s potential sales of genuine operating systems.” But Lundgren’s disks had no licenses and were intended for computers that already had licenses." and even worse, "Hurley decided Lundgren’s 28,000 restore disks had a value of $700,000, and that dollar amount qualified Lundgren…

I dont quite understand the basic legal details behind this. Say I buy a computer with windows pre-installed that means the OS license cost is bundled in to the price of the machine. Say I have a computer without windows, or maybe an older cheaper version of windows. Is it correct that these restore disks arent a utility to get a free new copy of windows? Just trying to understand

They are not a utility to get a free new copy of windows. However, that notwithstanding, copyright law grants Microsoft the exclusive right to arbitrarily restrict how these disks are created.

It's just like you can offer some content on your website for free to anyone, but sue anyone who redistributes it for copyright infringement.

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#64

Post by pbhjpbhj »

pweissbrod wrote: post #44
Hasz wrote: post #14

From the article "“These sales of counterfeit operating systems,” Microsoft lawyer Bonnie MacNaughton wrote to the judge, “displaced Microsoft’s potential sales of genuine operating systems.” But Lundgren’s disks had no licenses and were intended for computers that already had licenses." and even worse, "Hurley decided Lundgren’s 28,000 restore disks had a value of $700,000, and that dollar amount qualified Lundgren…

I dont quite understand the basic legal details behind this. Say I buy a computer with windows pre-installed that means the OS license cost is bundled in to the price of the machine. Say I have a computer without windows, or maybe an older cheaper version of windows. Is it correct that these restore disks arent a utility to get a free new copy of windows? Just trying to understand

A restore disk IME returns the computer to initial state, usually saving personal data if requested. One still has to enter the license information, just like if you downloaded a free MS Windows install image - the image is free, it doesn't come with a license.

I've given people access to a pre-written disc with such a download on, which they then enter their license details for. Presumably the judge would consider me guilty of copyright infringement if I were in USA.

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#66

Post by ssimpson »

pweissbrod wrote: post #44
Hasz wrote: post #14

From the article "“These sales of counterfeit operating systems,” Microsoft lawyer Bonnie MacNaughton wrote to the judge, “displaced Microsoft’s potential sales of genuine operating systems.” But Lundgren’s disks had no licenses and were intended for computers that already had licenses." and even worse, "Hurley decided Lundgren’s 28,000 restore disks had a value of $700,000, and that dollar amount qualified Lundgren…

I dont quite understand the basic legal details behind this. Say I buy a computer with windows pre-installed that means the OS license cost is bundled in to the price of the machine. Say I have a computer without windows, or maybe an older cheaper version of windows. Is it correct that these restore disks arent a utility to get a free new copy of windows? Just trying to understand

No. It used to be that you got a “restore disk” with your new computer. I’ve had a few dells that had this, Apple used to as well. Now if anything, there is a rescue partition or a utility that knows how to download an rescue image. Without a valid license key you shouldn’t be able to use the restore disk. A lot of people who got these just threw them away. This guy was trying to help them reset their computer to a good state. In this case Microsoft would prefer you buy a new license, but these people already have one (usually on a sticker on the computer somewhere).

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#67

Post by leonardschuetz »

pweissbrod wrote: post #44
Hasz wrote: post #14

From the article "“These sales of counterfeit operating systems,” Microsoft lawyer Bonnie MacNaughton wrote to the judge, “displaced Microsoft’s potential sales of genuine operating systems.” But Lundgren’s disks had no licenses and were intended for computers that already had licenses." and even worse, "Hurley decided Lundgren’s 28,000 restore disks had a value of $700,000, and that dollar amount qualified Lundgren…

I dont quite understand the basic legal details behind this. Say I buy a computer with windows pre-installed that means the OS license cost is bundled in to the price of the machine. Say I have a computer without windows, or maybe an older cheaper version of windows. Is it correct that these restore disks arent a utility to get a free new copy of windows? Just trying to understand

Yes, that's correct. As far as I understood, these restore disks were used to repair a broken windows installation. The restore disk can be downloaded for free on the internet, but if you don't have a windows license already, the disk is of no use to you.

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#68

Post by emh68 »

Can’t blame this on Microsoft. Legal department probably said “these disks look visually similar to Dell disks, therefore we must press charges or everyone will start stamping out lookalike CDs and they’ll be able to get away with it by pointing to us not pressing charges here”. Blame the legal system, not Microsoft. All companies are under such obligations to not dilute their IP.

Re: E-waste recycler loses appeal on computer restore disks, must serve prison term

#70

Post by [deleted] »

reimertz wrote: post #30

As a CEO, you can have a business model that is ethically and morally wrong without getting into jail. As a CEO, you can ignore obvious security flaws leading to 100 million social security numbers getting leaked without getting into jail. As a CEO, you can sexually harass your employees without getting into jail. Try and save the world by repurpose old computers, causing one of the biggest companies in the world to…

[deleted]
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