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Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

robmaceachern.com

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Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#61

Post by jtbayly »

tialaramex wrote: post #26
ugh123 wrote: post #8

>The new APIs are part of the StoreKit framework and include a new class called SKAdNetwork. >With the new set of APIs, Apple will become the intermediary between the app and advertising network for conversion tracking, eliminating the need for apps to install third-party ad SDKs which potentially expose sensitive user data. Am I missing something or is this not really any different than the 3rd party ad SDK problem…

Its proponents will tell you this doesn't have any tracking in it. Fully anonymous. Only the advert's ID gets passed along to track conversion. Who knows who could have clicked this advert, with the ID "Advert-presented-to-ugh123"? Could have been anyone. We've successfully masked out any tracking, hooray for Apple. Also I don't know enough about in-app and app-to-app advertising, but I'm surprised if the mechanisms…

My thoughts exactly! So, I programmatically name my campaigns per person, and I’ve still got perfect tracking.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#62

Post by tibyat »

jwegan wrote: post #37

This new SDK doesn't help advertisers or users. Being able to assess the quality of users coming from different ad networks is crucial for any advertiser to assess the quality of their spend. Some ad networks might generate high quality legitimate users, while others are fraught with click fraud, or low quality users. Since an advertiser isn't able to tell which users came from an ad, no advertiser will adopt it. If…

uh huh, and you’re not biased at all...

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#63

Post by duskwuff »

Rjevski wrote: post #57
duskwuff wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...even if an app slips through the cracks and only allows "Always" and "While using the app" as options... It can't. The permissions UI is rendered by the OS, not by the application. There's no way to hide the option to deny permissions.

Based on your previous reply I thought that the lack of apps that require location was due to Apple’s review process and not the fact that the “Never” button can’t be disabled.

It's both. If your app doesn't work properly when a user taps the "Never" button (which you can't get rid of), Apple rejects it.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#64

Post by ovao »

CaptSpify wrote: post #52
ovao wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Technically speaking, they have the option. Practically speaking, they do not have an option.

I don't see why not. Plenty of other organizations work that way. Why can't Apple?

Apple’s a publicly-held company, and China is among the largest markets for consumer electronics. Apple’s shareholders wouldn’t be too pleased if Apple simply said “nah” to such a market, and Apple’s obligations are ultimately to its shareholders.

The situation might be different if Apple was a different kind of company, but it is what it is.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#65

Post by CaptSpify »

ovao wrote: post #64
CaptSpify wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see why not. Plenty of other organizations work that way. Why can't Apple?

Apple’s a publicly-held company, and China is among the largest markets for consumer electronics. Apple’s shareholders wouldn’t be too pleased if Apple simply said “nah” to such a market, and Apple’s obligations are ultimately to its shareholders. The situation might be different if Apple was a different kind of company, but it is what it is.

I'm sorry, but I don't buy it. Prioritizing your users is completely an option. This is simply a choice in which Apple chooses money over it's users.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#66

Post by dingo_bat »

RKearney wrote: post #50
IBM wrote: post #2

>I can’t see Google and Facebook being thrilled about implementing support for this, but given the recent scandal involving Cambridge Analytica, Apple should have extra leverage to push them in this direction. If Apple makes it an App Store policy, what choice do they have?

It's also App Store policy to not lock built-in iOS features behind in-app purchases or subscriptions, yet Google gets away with it on the YouTube.app by only allowing background audio if you subscribe to YouTube Red.

Youtube in background is a built in ios feature?

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#67

Post by deftturtle »

dingo_bat wrote: post #66
RKearney wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's also App Store policy to not lock built-in iOS features behind in-app purchases or subscriptions, yet Google gets away with it on the YouTube.app by only allowing background audio if you subscribe to YouTube Red.

Youtube in background is a built in ios feature?

Apple willingly permits any application to subvert user control. You can't record your iPhone screen trough the lightning connection while using Netflix app. You can't send a fake GPS signal to apps, give fake contact files, or lie to your software. And you can't play background audio, because fundamentally Apple doesn't put user freedom first. I find it bizarre that an application on my phone could choose to not play my audio in the background.

If you can't lie to your software, then it controls you, and you have no power. Apple could do more in this aspect for control.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#68

Post by jwegan »

esturk wrote: post #46
marricks wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see why advertisers wouldn't like it, but how the heck isn't it good for users? You don't even have an explicit argument for that point, just the implicit "it might not be adopted." You're a bit disingenuous with your claim. As for your proposed system, it could work, but the advertiser might be able to deduce a bit as they track them through engagement. A black box seems like the best system for users, and if Appl…

Look at the OP's profile. Manager at Pinterest. Theres no doubt the attack is disgenuous because said individual have skin in the game. I usually don't mind if they disclose it upfront. But to hide it and present an argument as neutral is dishonest.

I'm not trying to hide it. Like you said it is right in my HN profile.

I don't work on Pinterest's ads business and I'm not very familiar with that side of the company. I'm speaking as someone who runs ads on other sites to try and drive traffic to Pinterest.

Also, like the other poster said, an ad-hominem attack is a classic logic fallacy. You are criticizing who is saying it and did not bring up a single critique of my actual argument.

Re: Apple’s New Ad Conversion Tracking Will Benefit User Privacy

#69

Post by jack9 »

Razengan wrote: post #51
jack9 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What attack? The Adtech Ecosystem is incestuous, corrupt and penultimately complicated. jwegan is technically correct and savvy enough to understand one of many problems with this kind of fluff announcement. The least of these problems is a strawman reaction that anyone who dismissed it, is a bad actor. New SDKs are born every day. Apple CANNOT PRESENT a new technology that isn't a variant of what already survives in…

Still not seeing any reason as to why it’s bad for users.

Adding another lie to the stack has the same consequences as before. More bloat in the sites and higher costs across the board.
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