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Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

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Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#61

Post by ben_w »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #47
retailbuyout wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if you think you can get max diversity of ideas without also pulling people from different cultures, you’ve been around way too many white men.

Diversity of ideas (and good ideas specifically) comes from education, reading a lot, listening to smart people, thinking, and maybe a bit from genetics. You're concentrating too much on the skin color. We should push smart people, we should create the culture of smart, so people want to become smart.

It also comes from different life experiences. If I’d made a period product based soley on what I’d been taught at school about women, it would definitely have been a business failure (as I found out by talking to a woman about my idea). You don’t have any way to know how different somebody’s life experiences have been until you ask them, but they’re more likely to be different if the sample set includes more gender, ethnic, nationality, sexuality, and religious diversity.

Concrete example, the number of times Americans assume I have a SSN. Or, on a trip to Kenya, my host assumed I’d know how to say grace before a meal. Or how I came to Berlin and assumed that finding a flat would be as easy as it was in the UK.

Edit: Just realised one obvious group I blindly forgot — poor people have very different experiences than rich people. $2/day absolute poverty, $10/day “you’re doing well by Kenyan standards”, $100/day Harlem average (chosen because it’s what non-Americans think of as a poor bit of America). All different from each other, all different lives from us, even if we don’t call ourselves rich.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#62

Post by icebraining »

mrschwabe wrote: post #32
CalChris wrote: post #2

I don't remember hearing that he left but Thiel isn't on the YC partner list on either Crunchbase or YC itself. https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/y-combinator/current... http://www.ycombinator.com/people/

Maybe he was kicked off the board for 'wrong think' - he certainly was chastised by members of Facebook's board for endorsing & contributing to Donald Trump's Presidential campaign (Trump's victory vindication of said endorsement & contribution). While Thiel was endorsing/investing who would ultimately win - YC's President did the opposite. While Theil's endorsement/investment in Trump was based on principal - I don'…

Sam Altman himself explicitly said they weren't cutting ties with Thiel after the donation was known and they were pressured to do so. It would be strange to withstand that criticism only to silently do so afterwards.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#63

Post by factsaresacred »

VeejayRampay wrote: post #55
factsaresacred wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have read that. He concedes the study is valid and the problems real and difficult. Then he adds his own opinion that nevertheless it's worth it. > In the short term, he writes, there are clearly challenges, but over the long haul, he argues that diversity has a range of benefits for a society, and that the fragmentation and distrust can be overcome. It’s not an easy process, but in the end it’s “well worth the eff…

> I mean, this stuff is intuitive for anybody with a sense of history Intuitive has nothing to do with fact, plenty of factors might heavily influence what one considers "intuitive". For a lot of people the necessity of the death penalty is "intuitive", yet for many societies, it's an absolute no-brainer that such practices are medieval. So again, unless there is a corpus of studies, all pointing in the same directio…

> We cannot really conclude anything.

Great! So when will we stop parading this nonsensical "diversity is our strength" mantra, or at least stop stigmatizing those that point out - as you have - that we cannot really conclude anything?

It has as much merit - and perhaps less, given the studies - as saying "diversity is not our strength".

You see the issue now?

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#64

Post by indubitable »

calcifer wrote: post #38
factsaresacred wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "dangers" of multiculturalism, gender and ethnic diversity I don't know if "dangers" is your word or his, but it's been shown (a priori and a posteriori) that multiculturalism and ethnic diversity erodes trust and causes social strive. This is opposed to cultural pluralism, where a dominant culture exists and tolerates additional values that don't erode or threaten the dominant culture. The reason I comment is…

> I sense once again an attempt to shame Thiel for his views You say that like there is some sort of hidden agenda. Personally I think there is nothing even remotely wrong with shaming Thiel for his deeply intolerant views. In order to maintain a tolerant society, the society must be intolerant of intolerance [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

Just because an individual opines on something doesn't somehow turn it into a sudden irrefutable fact. And that wiki article is completely devoid of examples aside from giving a number of other views on the topic - in which literally every single one disagrees with him. It's no different than arguing that the key to solving violence is violence. Wrapping a layer of specious logic around it makes it no more reasonable a suggestion.

It's interesting too in that I think everybody can see that violence inherently breeds violence, yet many remain blind to the fact that intolerance too breeds intolerance. We have two ends of political extremism today. The many things they have in common include the fact that they both are completely intolerant of the other side as they consider the other side completely intolerant. And as the mutual extremism grows, so too does the self righteous intolerance. That's going to end well...

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#65

Post by ddorian43 »

burnte wrote: post #6

I think we've seen Thiel do this before, indirectly fund opposition to organizations he doesn't like when he can't attack them directly. He's also funded lots of politicians that work quite hard to restrict rights at every level of government, including, frankly, that are rather adamantly against equal rights for gay people. He's a great representation that some people will align themselves with anyone to further the…

You put the quotes because you disagree with him though.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#66

Post by AJRF »

dguaraglia wrote: post #18
mrschwabe wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems clear you are eluding to his endorsement and $1m contribution to the Trump campaign. We share different views - I am happy to disagree with you because I think Peter Thiel is to be commended for conducting business in line with his own philosophical & political views: this is perhaps the entire goal of business. From my perspective, he clearly sees the need for change in this world and works diligently to see t…

No, I'm pretty sure he's referring to the whole Gawker vs. Hulk Hogan trial thing, which was one of the biggest attacks on freedom of the press in recent history. Whether you believe Gawker deserved it or not, he used Terry Bollea (Hogan) as a prop to push his own agenda.

> one of the biggest attacks on freedom of the press in recent history

Not even close.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#67

Post by akhilcacharya »

VeejayRampay wrote: post #36
factsaresacred wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "dangers" of multiculturalism, gender and ethnic diversity I don't know if "dangers" is your word or his, but it's been shown (a priori and a posteriori) that multiculturalism and ethnic diversity erodes trust and causes social strive. This is opposed to cultural pluralism, where a dominant culture exists and tolerates additional values that don't erode or threaten the dominant culture. The reason I comment is…

The absolute irony of a post on an account whose handle is "facts are sacred" that just declares that "multiculturalism and ethnic diversity erodes trust and causes social strive" without providing any form of justification, proof, actual study about the subject, without thinking about the pre-existing bias that might exist in society to make that all of that difficult on a daily basis. Weak sauce.

This is exactly how ethnic nationalism in America becomes normalized. Reminds me of the kid who protested in Charlottesville explaining that he wasn't a racist, he just really hated mass immigration and the ensuing diversity after 1965 (which was when immigration became accessible to non Europeans..).

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#68

Post by ddorian43 »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #47
retailbuyout wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, if you think you can get max diversity of ideas without also pulling people from different cultures, you’ve been around way too many white men.

Diversity of ideas (and good ideas specifically) comes from education, reading a lot, listening to smart people, thinking, and maybe a bit from genetics. You're concentrating too much on the skin color. We should push smart people, we should create the culture of smart, so people want to become smart.

'maybe a bit from genetics' ... I understand that we should have a dream to achieve anything we like besides our genes but it's False.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#69

Post by sillysaurus3 »

factsaresacred wrote: post #63
VeejayRampay wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I mean, this stuff is intuitive for anybody with a sense of history Intuitive has nothing to do with fact, plenty of factors might heavily influence what one considers "intuitive". For a lot of people the necessity of the death penalty is "intuitive", yet for many societies, it's an absolute no-brainer that such practices are medieval. So again, unless there is a corpus of studies, all pointing in the same directio…

> We cannot really conclude anything. Great! So when will we stop parading this nonsensical "diversity is our strength" mantra, or at least stop stigmatizing those that point out - as you have - that we cannot really conclude anything? It has as much merit - and perhaps less, given the studies - as saying "diversity is not our strength". You see the issue now?

When taking a controversial side, it's important to be calm and make cogent arguments.

It's hard. Especially when it feels like people are going out of their way to misinterpret or frame you. But it's worth it.

Re: Is billionaire VC Peter Thiel trying to break up Google?

#70

Post by AJRF »

bufferoverflow wrote: post #15
oculusthrift wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

held to account != able to be sued legally. i agree that getting protested is one thug but getting sued and shut down is a legal issue which is contrary to free speech

No, it's not. Freedom of speech doesn't cover slander/libel. Freedom of speech means government can't put you in a cage for your expressed ideas (with few exceptions, like yelling fire in a theater).

> yelling fire in a theater

Just googled this. Thanks for bringing it up, I hadn't heard about this case before.

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