Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

petapixel.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

61–70 of 447 posts

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#61

Post by mikeash »

ajross wrote: post #44
mikeash wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The author appealed, stating that the delivery address was incorrect. Amazon's rejected the appeal on the basis that the tracking information "shows that someone at your address signed for the package." That's not a mysterious hole that low-level employees are unaware of, that's just inattention on the part of whoever was handling the appeal.

The point was more that "mysterious hole" and "innatention" are mostly the same thing. My words were "scams are hard to detect" and I stand by them. The people you want to be more attentive make hourly wages and probably see thousands of these appeals every week, statistically none of which are creative scams worthy of arguing about on HN. You're asking too much. Those employees don't exist. You have to get over thei…

I don't get how this shows that "scams are hard to detect." This scam was trivial to detect. When the seller's supposed proof of delivery shows a different address, then it's not actually proof of delivery. All it would have taken to detect this was looking at the tracking info and looking at the order's shipping address and observing that they weren't the same.

Yes, obviously something is terribly wrong at Amazon which meant that this simple comparison never happened, but I don't see why we should expect this, or why we should be sympathetic to Amazon about it.

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#63

Post by codegeek »

ajross wrote: post #9
davidu wrote: post #2

It seems like the Amazon reps weren't paying attention to the detail, or the seller was also supplying fraudulent evidence of delivery. This blog post will likely get it resolved for the buyer, though it shouldn't have to be this way.

I'm more sympathetic to Amazon here than most. Scams are hard to detect. They set up a shipping confirmation process that's worked fine for them for almost two decades now. It has a hole (it only checks the town and has no closed loop to verify that the shipper shipped to the right address in that town), but none of the existing employees actually know that it has a hole. They get a report about a missing shipment, c…

I dont get why you are being sympathetic towards Amazon. They delivered the package to a WRONG address and then closed the case just because it was delivered to the SAME town ? Don't you see an issue with Amazon's system here ? This is just incompetence and nothing else. I love amazon but this particular case is just incompetence on Amazon's part after the fraud happened.

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#64

Post by wizzard »

vgprice wrote: post #36

I don't even buy anything that is not sold via Prime. I assume anything non-prime is of the lowest possible quality or a scam. For some reason I feel comfortable with prime thinking that the items have had some sort of quality approval. (at least getting my item as described and expected.)

I think you mean "sold by Amazon"? Third parties can take advantage of prime shipping, and people have been scammed via that method as well.

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#65

Post by jacquesm »

mikeash wrote: post #26

I'm wondering more and more why Amazon hosts third-party sellers at all. They dilute the Amazon brand to a tremendous degree. It used to be that buying from Amazon meant a certain level of quality and service. Now there are really two Amazons: the old one, and a new one that's basically a shitty version of eBay. I have to go out of my way to avoid these crappy third-party sellers when I'm searching for stuff on Amazo…

Is there a way to just turn third party offers off?

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#66

Post by ceejayoz »

jjnoakes wrote: post #58
ceejayoz wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if you've got EC2 instances or Kindle books.

For the truly paranoid: have two amazon accounts, one for services (AWS, Kindle, etc) you care about, and one for purchases that you wish to protect.

That's not necessarily going to protect you if they can link the two - same address, same card, etc.

https://www.bekkelund.net/2012/10/22/outlawed-by-amazon-drm/

> We have found your account is directly related to another which has been previously closed for abuse of our policies. As such, your Amazon.co.uk account has been closed and any open orders have been cancelled.

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#67

Post by mikeash »

btown wrote: post #59
mikeash wrote: post #26

I'm wondering more and more why Amazon hosts third-party sellers at all. They dilute the Amazon brand to a tremendous degree. It used to be that buying from Amazon meant a certain level of quality and service. Now there are really two Amazons: the old one, and a new one that's basically a shitty version of eBay. I have to go out of my way to avoid these crappy third-party sellers when I'm searching for stuff on Amazo…

What the brand gains at the expense of quality is MUCH more valuable: the notion that "if I only have time to check one website, Amazon's going to have it because Amazon has EVERYTHING." Adding third-party sellers allows it to have a much larger catalog of obscure items. Any shopper who's been burned will still use Amazon in the way you are, just being careful to filter by Prime and/or Fulfilled by Amazon. So the dam…

The notion that "Amazon has EVERYTHING" only works if you can actually count on the purchase to work. Once it becomes apparent that third-party sellers are crap and those items don't count, you're back to "Amazon has certain things."

And I'm not merely careful to filter stuff. Amazon is no longer my go-to in general. I do buy stuff from them sometimes, but they're not the first place I check for most things.

A less savvy buyer probably won't even do that. If they get burned too badly on an Amazon purchase, they'll just abandon Amazon, not learn which checkboxes mean "hide the scams."

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#68

Post by mars4rp »

mikeash wrote: post #26

I'm wondering more and more why Amazon hosts third-party sellers at all. They dilute the Amazon brand to a tremendous degree. It used to be that buying from Amazon meant a certain level of quality and service. Now there are really two Amazons: the old one, and a new one that's basically a shitty version of eBay. I have to go out of my way to avoid these crappy third-party sellers when I'm searching for stuff on Amazo…

I used to sell some items on Amazon and paying them %15 - %25 of sell price. I think this is where Amazon makes its major money. I was costing Amazon very little, unlike Prime and free one day shipping, 2 hours shipping, etc.

I think Amazon lose money on lots of its own services to drive customers in, and force 3rd party sellers to use its service for a nice commission.

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#69

Post by ajross »

mikeash wrote: post #61
ajross wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point was more that "mysterious hole" and "innatention" are mostly the same thing. My words were "scams are hard to detect" and I stand by them. The people you want to be more attentive make hourly wages and probably see thousands of these appeals every week, statistically none of which are creative scams worthy of arguing about on HN. You're asking too much. Those employees don't exist. You have to get over thei…

I don't get how this shows that "scams are hard to detect." This scam was trivial to detect. When the seller's supposed proof of delivery shows a different address, then it's not actually proof of delivery. All it would have taken to detect this was looking at the tracking info and looking at the order's shipping address and observing that they weren't the same. Yes, obviously something is terribly wrong at Amazon wh…

> This scam was trivial to detect.

No, it's trivial to understand. It's simply an objective truth that it's hard to detect, given that you and I are hearing about it for the first time in August of the year 2017, when it exploits a USPS tracking data that probably hasn't changed much in 15 years or more. If it's so trivial why didn't you figure it out before? Why haven't Amazon and the post office closed the hole? Why haven't more people been scammed?

Re: I Fell Victim to a $1,500 Used Camera Lens Scam on Amazon

#70

Post by megiddo »

soyiuz wrote: post #52

The A-Z guarantee is actually pretty biased towards the costumer. Something went wrong here obviously, but in part it is a side effect of too much information. There was no need to go visit your neighbors--once the wrong address is confirmed, A-Z should come into effect. Get someone on the phone if you can. The larger problem is the integrity of the package. For example, as a seller, I've had multiple chargebacks fro…

Escrow
Post reply on HN