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What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

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Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#61

Post by zawy »

petertodd wrote: post #30
hendzen wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Peter, You just cherry picked one (minor) point from each article, and then used an argument against those points to claim that both articles are incorrect in full . I think that is a dishonest form of argument. Furthermore, it's worth disclosing your own personal dislike of Mike Hearn - you guys have spent a huge amount of time attacking one another... so I'm inclined to discount any of your statements on him.

We seem to have a fundamentally different outlook on this. First of all, I'm busy - I'm not going to do a point-by-point takedown of the article if I can avoid it. Secondly, if you can show an author clearly lied about anything - and I think I have clearly shown that - it immediately calls into question the value of the rest of the work. That saves time and effort for the reader, in much the same way that showing a s…

Relying on errors or lies on some points to "disprove" the other parts is itself an ad-hominem. Also, if you have a problem with his ethics, then I have an ethical problem with you if you still want to be friends with him. More to the point, in one post you've given me two causes of concern in regards to your ability to be honest with yourself and therefore to others.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#62

Post by twblalock »

trophycase wrote: post #53
ForHackernews wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There are a lot of people out there who are very aware of how their saved money loses value and actively want an alternative that feels "safe". Inflation-linked government bonds (e.g. https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/products/prod_tips_glan... ) are extremely safe, and specifically protect against value lost to inflation. There are some problems solved by bitcoin, but needing a stable store of value certainly i…

How liquid/easy to trade are these bonds compared to Bitcoin, which I can spend and exchange for USD in minutes?

You can sell TIPS on the secondary market whenever you want, and you can redeem I-Bonds directly with the treasury after one year. The only delay is the electronic transfer to your bank account from your broker or the treasury.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#63

Post by twblalock »

elmar wrote: post #60
mikeash wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what the big deal is there. I can understand it in a hyperinflation situation, but when inflation is ~2%, surely this hidden tax is insignificant compared to the more visible, explicit taxes?

let's do some assumptions: - the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10% - with no government monetary intervention we should have deflation let's assume around 5% the delta is now 10%~15% looks less insignificant.

> the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10%

I can't find any evidence-based reason to believe that.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#64

Post by mikeash »

elmar wrote: post #60
mikeash wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand what the big deal is there. I can understand it in a hyperinflation situation, but when inflation is ~2%, surely this hidden tax is insignificant compared to the more visible, explicit taxes?

let's do some assumptions: - the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10% - with no government monetary intervention we should have deflation let's assume around 5% the delta is now 10%~15% looks less insignificant.

How long does it take for new money to get into the hands of the average person? I'd think a couple of months. A 15% inflation delta then means an "invisible tax" of maybe 3%. Not very important. And that's ignoring the highly questionable nature of those stated assumptions.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#65

Post by elmar »

twblalock wrote: post #63
elmar wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

let's do some assumptions: - the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10% - with no government monetary intervention we should have deflation let's assume around 5% the delta is now 10%~15% looks less insignificant.

> the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10% I can't find any evidence-based reason to believe that.

Alternate Inflation Charts

http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/inflation-charts

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#66

Post by elmar »

mikeash wrote: post #64
elmar wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

let's do some assumptions: - the 2% inflation number is completely wrong and real inflation is around 5%~10% - with no government monetary intervention we should have deflation let's assume around 5% the delta is now 10%~15% looks less insignificant.

How long does it take for new money to get into the hands of the average person? I'd think a couple of months. A 15% inflation delta then means an "invisible tax" of maybe 3%. Not very important. And that's ignoring the highly questionable nature of those stated assumptions.

I have seen studies where it could take up to 2 years for the new money to completely penetrate the economic system.

Unfortunately currently don't have the links, I will try to post it later.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#68

Post by omarchowdhury »

honestlyreally wrote: post #57
twblalock wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do people seem to assume that those most capable of implementing the cryptography, networking, or other code are also those most capable of understanding the economics of cryptocurrencies or determining their future? I guess I'll give the blunt answer: many proponents of cryptocurrency have views on economics, politics, society, law, and contracts that are ignorant of the way those things really work. Many real…

> The blockchain is an interesting technical achievement, and so are smart contracts, but they are not a replacement for laws and governments. A lot of Venezuelans would disagree with you there. History clearly shows governments fail to act responisbly with currency. In the last 25 years, 21 countries experienced hyperinflation. What do you propose people in those counties do? Your comment was big on problems but off…

> And this is not just poor countries, a woman in Saudi Arabia cannot open a bank account without a mans permission. That same woman can create a bitcoin wallet in one minute.

But when she needs to turn it back into fiat, guess what, she's going to need a bank account to receive the funds from the exchange.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#69

Post by dang »

hokkos wrote: post #56
sametmax wrote: post #6

"What did X ever do for us?" is the standard catch phrase of this guy in any pirate movie wanting to take command of the ship. It's not the words of somebody who wants to help anybody, just somebody wanting the power.

It is clearly satire and a Monty Python reference, how can you be so wrong ?

Many (maybe even most) of the misunderstandings on HN have to do with people talking across national or regional lines without being aware of it. I don't know, but it would be natural if that were the case here.

Re: What did Bitcoin Core contributors ever do for us?

#70

Post by omarchowdhury »

hendzen wrote: post #26
haakon wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fixed, pre-determined inflation rate has been part of Bitcoin since its launch, and is widely regarded as one of the most fundamental, immutable rules of Bitcoin, much like "software freedom" is to Debian. It is not something that is widely cited by the Bitcoin community as a problem, and I'm unaware of any efforts to change it. It has nothing to do with Bitcoin Core.

The fixed supply doesn't really make sense if you want BTC to function as a unit of exchange (rather than a commodity). I won't go in to the reasons why since they have been elaborated on by many other people. However, the fixed supply does incentivize holders (ahem hodlers ) to increase the value of the coin - whether that is by starting companies that use BTC, spamming HN with BTC/Reddit related posts, etc. It's an…

But you do know that a Bitcoin is divisible? A satoshi is one hundred millionth of a single Bitcoin. Why would there need to be an increase in supply to make Bitcoin a unit of exchange if its that divisible? Other than for psychological reasons?
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