61–70 of 75 posts
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What is playing it safe? Keeping it in cash in a bank account?
> Keeping it in cash in a bank account? Yes. There are accounts in Poland which pay around 0-2% post-tax above inflation (the number vary year-to-year, depending on current economical conditions), which will help the capital still earn a bit of money.
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My plan is to retire in 5-7 years. I could do that sooner if I went into stock market (and prayed that the mythical 4% per year returns will be sustainable in the future) or became a landlord, but I prefer to play it safe.
Would you be retiring in Poland? What kind of monthly expense do you foresee? I'm also dreaming of doing this, though currently on the other side of the world.
Yes, retiring in Poland. My plan is to go broke at 90-95.
I'm thinking 5000-6000 PLN per month ($1300-$1500), plus owning a property, will allow for a great living. This should even cover a very good nursing home (well as far as these places can ever be very good) when I'm unable to take care of myself. (I dont' and won't have children).
BTW there seems to be plenty of people from the UK who moved permanently to SE Asia (I imagine it can be cheaper than Poland + no winters) and who are sustained via rent from their London flat/house.
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> Keeping it in cash in a bank account? Yes. There are accounts in Poland which pay around 0-2% post-tax above inflation (the number vary year-to-year, depending on current economical conditions), which will help the capital still earn a bit of money.
Keeping your entire net worth in one currency seems pretty risky to me. Nothing is ever as it seems.
Eastern Europe is state of mind, not a geographical location. It just boggles my mind why a young person (like the article author) would choose to think in such a lazy manner and beat that narrative to death -- corruption, local economy, the struggle to run legitimate business, etc. With all due my respect and w/ the risk of being downvoted -- that is BS; and completely opposite of the SV mindset. It just shows that…
Author here. Perhaps I put a little bit too much drama in the classic Eastern European issues. I'm not complaining, I do acknowledge the advancement of Bulgaria's economy (it's definitely not like the 90s as far as the narratives go), but I'm not very satisfied with the competitiveness of our country on the global scene. Take Singapore for example - it's more deprived than Bulgaria in numerous aspects, yet it is one of the technological powerhouses of Asia. I'm not focusing on the problems; I'm focusing on what could be improved and leveraged from the current situation.
> ...there are numerous large-scale companies w/ strong regional presence, as well various small outsourcing shops...
True, but for how long have the co-working spaces been around? Around 5 years. Healthy companies? Since we joined the EU (~10 years). All the companies before that period (Sciant, Telerik, Chaos Group etc.) were made of a bunch of extremely talented young people willing to work almost for free in order to gain reputation and recognition from outside. Plus, the working conditions you mentioned apply only for no more than 20,000 people employed in the tech industry in Bulgaria. The majority of the population is in survival mode.
There is much to be improved.
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Would you be retiring in Poland? What kind of monthly expense do you foresee? I'm also dreaming of doing this, though currently on the other side of the world.
> Would you be retiring in Poland? What kind of monthly expense do you foresee? Yes, retiring in Poland. My plan is to go broke at 90-95. I'm thinking 5000-6000 PLN per month ($1300-$1500), plus owning a property, will allow for a great living. This should even cover a very good nursing home (well as far as these places can ever be very good) when I'm unable to take care of myself. (I dont' and won't have children).…
I would like to retire in Europe. Thanks for your answer, it's nice to have a realistic ballpark figure.
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For all, be aware that this kind of money are extremely rare (but doable in some niches) in Poland. Half of that is generally perceived as very good salary for most IT jobs, and median is probably quarter of that.
Yep - even our prime minister/president doesn't make that much a month, more like half that. I used to know a Polish guy making million Polish zloty/year(so about $300k) but he was the head of the Polish division of a major German insurance company. Most of my Polish friends working in Poland as programmers(ranging from C++ to Web development) make about ~$2500-3500/month, and that's considered extremely good for whe…
But still, you can work remotely for a US company and make that kind of money. That's pretty realistic and was probably the source of the fortune cookie wisdom.
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I don't live in EE (and maybe I'm naive about this), but shouldn't it actually be easier to find great talent if you put in an effort? I mean, there are great people in pretty much in every country, and if the alternative is, say, (boring) outsourcing development work, shouldn't you be able to convince people with above average (local) pay and offering them a great place to work, etc?
> convince people with above average (local) pay and offering them a great place to work With hardly any VC money around, you don't really have a way to pay for those.
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Yes, if you can manage to find even some 40k or 50k/year contract it will put you into about 5% of top earner in population in many central/east european countries. Prices are not as low as you might imagine, but it will give you a very nice life standards. You are not going to be able to afford luxury cars or other luxury items (those costs the same everywhere), but otherwise you would be set.
You will be rich in Eastern Europe but you'll still be considered average/poor in the developed world. Doesn't sound like a huge bargain to me.
Fortune cookie: a niche IT job in Eastern Europe will, with high probability, grant you the best life standards available worldwide.
A great number of my Romanian programmer friends have already started to realize this and have stopped emigrating to other European countries. Yeah, moving to a place like London would most probably get you 2 or maximum 3 times the salary you are now getting, but you'd also have to pay rent which is 8 to 10 times higher in London, going out is outrageously expensive (7 pounds for buying a beer in a pub after a day's…
Except for the few lucky ones in SV who cash(ed) out in time, these toys are mostly bought on credit. Salaries are high, but so are the costs.
The overwhelming majority --by a huge margin-- of entrepreneurs have never done any of this.
Your perception is skewed by reading HN and following the Silicon Valley "culture". That isn't at all a reflection of the majority. In Silicon Valley and in politics there are certain things you might have to do to signal club membership.
In the case of starting and running a business none of the items you list are a necessary part of success at all. I know people who are doing multiple millions of dollars a year in revenue who have never gone to hackathons, contributed to OSS, started a blog (that one is particularly funny) or spent time answering questions on SO.
The shadows you are looking at are not reality.
Note: Before anyone thinks that's an insult, google "Plato cave" and read it.