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David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

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Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#61

Post by danhon »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #59
threeseed wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is the theory. And there is the reality. The theory says it shouldn't matter who you are it should only be based on your professional ability. And in theory it wouldn't make a difference to the ability of a company to function whether the gender or racial mix was one sided or not. The reality is different. The reality is that having a uniform gender and race mix across a company causes all sorts of problems to…

How does this reality , this idea that companies are dysfunctional if gender and race are uniform, fit the data of the previous few thousand years of human progress? Has the world changed? Can groups of uniform gender-race people no longer act cordially to people who aren't same gender-race?

Hold the front page, groups of uniform gender-race people have acted cordially to people who aren't the same gender race for thousands of years? Citation needed.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#62

Post by obstinate »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #59
threeseed wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is the theory. And there is the reality. The theory says it shouldn't matter who you are it should only be based on your professional ability. And in theory it wouldn't make a difference to the ability of a company to function whether the gender or racial mix was one sided or not. The reality is different. The reality is that having a uniform gender and race mix across a company causes all sorts of problems to…

How does this reality , this idea that companies are dysfunctional if gender and race are uniform, fit the data of the previous few thousand years of human progress? Has the world changed? Can groups of uniform gender-race people no longer act cordially to people who aren't same gender-race?

> Can groups of uniform gender-race people no longer act cordially to people who aren't same gender-race?

"No longer?" At what point did they ever?

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#63

Post by obstinate »

you_go_first wrote: post #46
landon32 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, because females have different life experiences than males. There is no way around that. Society treats females and males differently from birth. Running short on time, but this page links to a bunch of relevant studies: http://www.spertus.com/ellen/Gender/pap/node7.html

> Society treats females and males differently from birth. So what you're saying is that both are on the receiving end of sexism because both are treated different on account of their gender.

Sort of, although the downsides are unevenly suffered. The patriarchy is bad for men, but it is far worse for women.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#64

Post by aaron-lebo »

danhon wrote: post #61
TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does this reality , this idea that companies are dysfunctional if gender and race are uniform, fit the data of the previous few thousand years of human progress? Has the world changed? Can groups of uniform gender-race people no longer act cordially to people who aren't same gender-race?

Hold the front page, groups of uniform gender-race people have acted cordially to people who aren't the same gender race for thousands of years? Citation needed.

I believe what he's saying is that without the action of individuals within certain groups, it would be impossible for those in groups without power to progress. If they were uniformly racist and sexist, then progress could not have been made.

That's to say they are capable of it, not that it's ideal or that they were responsible solely for progress. Most abolitionists were not African-American.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#65

Post by stale2002 »

you_go_first wrote: post #46
landon32 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, because females have different life experiences than males. There is no way around that. Society treats females and males differently from birth. Running short on time, but this page links to a bunch of relevant studies: http://www.spertus.com/ellen/Gender/pap/node7.html

> Society treats females and males differently from birth. So what you're saying is that both are on the receiving end of sexism because both are treated different on account of their gender.

Yes, and males and females experience that sexism in different ways.

So a man isnt going to experience the same problems that women experience, and vice versa. Which is why it is important to have a diversity of perspectives.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#66

Post by initstick »

dbnoch wrote: post #17
initstick wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FTFY: He needs to be replaced by a more qualified individual. It doesn't matter what gender they identify as.

While I understand the sentiment... it DOES matter what gender they identify as. Uber's culture issues deal with sexism and harassment towards Women. You need a diverse group for the board and adding white males will not fix their issue.

So how many ways do you cut the diversity pie? You've now introduced skin color on top of gender. You've also removed the slice that represents "white" (whatever that means) males. Is it your stance that the pie now only represents females? What about other groups of people, how about we slice it into socioeconomic pieces, age, hair color, weight, etc.

The point is, your vision of diversity is just anti-white-male. You'll be satisfied until you find too many representatives of whatever arbitrary label you come up with next.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#67

Post by nemothekid »

aaron-lebo wrote: post #49
dogecoinbase wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe you could replace a sexist old man with a man who isn't sexist? This is not testable. Move what you can measure.

Ok, so how do you test that a female hire isn't racist?

By not moving the goalposts.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#68

Post by initstick »

qq66 wrote: post #52
you_go_first wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about an openly gay white male? Or an immigrant? Or a black person? A muslim? A disabled person? An atheist that grew up in the south? A baptist that grew up in the Bay Area? There are plenty of different individuals out there that would be qualified to give perspective on being on the receiving end of a toxic culture. What about a straight while male with strong prior experience changing the culture at a compan…

But in Uber's particular case, the company has a serious problem with women in particular. There haven't been accusations of problems with gay men, or immigrants, or black people. There have been multiple accusations of Uber taking a flippant or dismissive approach to sexual harrassment of women. Imagine Uber had persistent database consistency problems, and a nontechnical member of the board laughed them off, and ha…

How would you QUALIFY an expert in database consistency? Measure their skills and history I presume. Which is precisely my comment which kicked off this thread.

> He needs to be replaced by a more qualified individual

Being a woman doesn't make you an expert in sexism. Anyone, regardless of race, gender, or creed could fit that role. So long as they are QUALIFIED.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#69

Post by throwaway-1209 »

pgodzin wrote: post #21
initstick wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FTFY: He needs to be replaced by a more qualified individual. It doesn't matter what gender they identify as.

A woman with a perspective on the diversity and culture they need to create seems uniquely qualified for the role.

"Diversity hiring" is a double edged sword though. There's a stigma attached to it which is really hard to overcome even if you're good.

Re: David Bonderman Resigns from Uber Board

#70

Post by flylib »

lancewiggs wrote: post #2

The right thing to do. He needs to be replaced by a woman, and to Ariana's point they need several on the board. Plenty of work required to change the toxic culture at Uber.

he still has the board seat, it's TPG board seat, he can pick one of his co-workers
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