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Lyft adds a new app for drivers

businessinsider.com

61–70 of 106 posts

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#61
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they're going to the trouble of pre-arranging the ride, why don't they just use cash/Venmo/Square, and keep Uber's cut of the fare?

That's what I would do with my driver. She'd arrive, and I would look up an Uber cost estimate, and then pay her cash for the average amount I was quoted. I also could ask her to run errands for me, using this same system.

It seems like there is no benefit to you at all.

Paying the average amount means you're paying more than some fares.

By paying cash, you lose out on all insurance in cash of an accident.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#62
post #58
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they're going to the trouble of pre-arranging the ride, why don't they just use cash/Venmo/Square, and keep Uber's cut of the fare?

Assuming you mean, other than the ethical concerns? A) Who's insuring the ride? If it's not insured and the driver is at fault in a collision, there could be no one to pay for injuries to you -- Lyft/Uber certainly wouldn't owe anything for stuff booked outside their platform. Usually when they drive for a TNC, the TNC provides the insurance for the driver in the course of using the app. It's really unlikely for the…

This is a great point: Who's insuring the ride? [..] Lyft/Uber certainly wouldn't owe anything for stuff booked outside their platform.

Most drivers have a "Rideshare Rider" from their auto insurance provider...but not sure if it extends to off-service rides

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#63
post #58
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they're going to the trouble of pre-arranging the ride, why don't they just use cash/Venmo/Square, and keep Uber's cut of the fare?

Assuming you mean, other than the ethical concerns? A) Who's insuring the ride? If it's not insured and the driver is at fault in a collision, there could be no one to pay for injuries to you -- Lyft/Uber certainly wouldn't owe anything for stuff booked outside their platform. Usually when they drive for a TNC, the TNC provides the insurance for the driver in the course of using the app. It's really unlikely for the…

Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do.

Point (B) doesn't make sense to me. Why do you have to accept and then cancel? You just get the driver's phone number and talk to them directly.

In fact, if this is not common already, I think it undermines the contention of these companies that they are merely a service being provided to independent contractors. If drivers are independent contractors, of course they should be trying to build their own brand and dedicated clientele.

Point (A) is a good one, though. Sounds like there should be independent insurance providers that these independent contractors can use.

If you're instead saying that drivers are employees of these companies, then maybe you're right about all the rest of it. But you can't have it both ways!

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#64
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they're going to the trouble of pre-arranging the ride, why don't they just use cash/Venmo/Square, and keep Uber's cut of the fare?

Yes I wonder what makes this different from the Homejoy situation

The difference with Homejoy was that many people on their site already had existing cleaning companies. They were using Homejoy for customer acquisition. Once that customer was acquired, there was no need for Homejoy. Once Homejoy was out of the picture, the cleaners regular liability insurance would still be in play. Obviously there were some cleaners that did not have a business.

The difference with Uber/Lyft is that these drivers don't have a business outside of the app. Therefore, once you eliminate the app, you eliminate their commercial insurance and it becomes a really interesting situation if there were ever an accident.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#65

I don't think scheduling a ride a few days in advance actually helps the drivers. One of the best things about Uber or Lyft for the drivers is that they don't have to think about scheduling, they're told exactly where to drive. If they have a scheduled ride and they forget about it, or they're stuck waiting around to make that ride and lose business, that doesn't seem like it will be popular. One big thing that Uber…

I think the key to the article is that when the ride is booked in advance, the driver sees the route and destination. A big compliant from drivers is that you accept a ride and you don't know if you are going 1 mile down the road or 100 miles to the middle of no where. Now the driver can see before accepting the ride (for these advanced booked trips).

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#66
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming you mean, other than the ethical concerns? A) Who's insuring the ride? If it's not insured and the driver is at fault in a collision, there could be no one to pay for injuries to you -- Lyft/Uber certainly wouldn't owe anything for stuff booked outside their platform. Usually when they drive for a TNC, the TNC provides the insurance for the driver in the course of using the app. It's really unlikely for the…

Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do. Point (B) doesn't make sense to me. Why do you have to accept and then cancel? You just get the driver's phone number and talk to them directly. In fact, if this is not common already, I think it undermines the contention of these c…

>Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do.

Their service was connecting drivers and riders -- allowing them to find each other for the transaction. They connected you. That was their service. (They provide other related intermediary services, but the "finding" function is the big one.)

Same issue as when a recruiter finds leads and the employer makes an offer to the employee directly and cuts out the recruiter, which is why they set up a bunch of contractual barriers to stop it.

EDIT: Sorry, I misunderstood the use case -- that wouldn't apply to future bookings after the first one's been completed and they've exchanged information. But the "moat" there is the difficulty of iterating through your network of past uber drivers for each future ride.

>Point (B) doesn't make sense to me. Why do you have to accept and then cancel? You just get the driver's phone number and talk to them directly.

AFAIK, they don't give you any way to contacting each other until the ride is accepted. Am I mistaken here?

>If you're instead saying that drivers are employees of these companies, then maybe you're right about all the rest of it. But you can't have it both ways!

No. You can have a legitimate claim to compensation for connecting two people without the seller thereby being your employee -- see the recruiting example (though it's a bit confusing in that there is another employment relationship in the picture but I'm sure you see the mapping -- a recruiter can legitimately claim that they're owed a cut while not saying that their the employer of the, er, hiring manage or the candidate).

EDIT: As above, that wouldn't apply to future rides or job offers after that contract.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#67
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do. Point (B) doesn't make sense to me. Why do you have to accept and then cancel? You just get the driver's phone number and talk to them directly. In fact, if this is not common already, I think it undermines the contention of these c…

>Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do. Their service was connecting drivers and riders -- allowing them to find each other for the transaction. They connected you. That was their service. (They provide other related intermediary services, but the "finding" function is t…

There is no moral or ethical obligation to compensate Lyft or Uber for future rides not on their platform.

Also, it seems anyone could replicate this feature by using Stripe Connect. It's cool, but expect rapid commoditization of preplanned ride coordination.

Edit: comment recinded due to OPs edit.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#68
post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Out of curiosity, what are the ethical concerns? The arrangement is not being made by the middleman company. I don't see how it is unethical to not pay them for something they did not do. Their service was connecting drivers and riders -- allowing them to find each other for the transaction. They connected you. That was their service. (They provide other related intermediary services, but the "finding" function is t…

There is no moral or ethical obligation to compensate Lyft or Uber for future rides not on their platform. Also, it seems anyone could replicate this feature by using Stripe Connect. It's cool, but expect rapid commoditization of preplanned ride coordination. Edit: comment recinded due to OPs edit.

>There is no moral or ethical obligation to compensate Lyft or Uber for future rides not on their platform.

Sorry, you're right, I misunderstood -- see the edit.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#69
post #8

So this is of course anecdotal but the only time I book taxis is when it's very important I get somewhere in time, like catching a plane early in the morning. Given the nature of Uber/Lyft it would take a lot before I would trust them with this.

In fact, Ride-sharing is why I can take a car to the airport.

My local taxi companies were so unreliable that I also drove and parked in long term for vacations.

It's only on the last couple of years that I feel comfortable enough to get a Lyft or Uber to airport and actually expect to make it timely ever time.

Re: Lyft adds a new app for drivers

#70

I don't think scheduling a ride a few days in advance actually helps the drivers. One of the best things about Uber or Lyft for the drivers is that they don't have to think about scheduling, they're told exactly where to drive. If they have a scheduled ride and they forget about it, or they're stuck waiting around to make that ride and lose business, that doesn't seem like it will be popular. One big thing that Uber…

Think about potential drivers in rural areas. I can see this being a key feature that helps Lyft expand into areas with low population density and sparse ridership. Drivers don't want to turn on the app and wait all day -- they'd rather schedule that trip in advance.
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