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Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

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Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#61

Post by computerex »

ruleabidinguser wrote: post #21
chickenfries wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a benefit if your engineers already know JavaScript, obviously. Also, emacs is one of the most successful text editors so I'm not sure I get your comparison.

I don't consider emacs successful. Succesful among fanatics, maybe, but I don't consider is valuable to a serious programmer. Also, surely it's not that hard to switch languages? In my experience all languages are essentially the same.

Not useful to serious programmers? Do you feel the same way about Vim? Just because you haven't gotten used to using something, doesn't mean it's necessarily total shit. There is a reason why people have been using emacs for decades.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#62

Post by jnordwick »

I'm way more worried about memory issues while running. Atom take up 1 gig+ with very little open. It pushes all my other tools out of RAM and into swap. Switching to the browser to see documentation takes a few seconds if I'm lucky.

Compiling a few more seconds to page in. Ssh a few more. Everything on my laptop slows to a crawl as they fight for RAM with Atom taking up the way more than it should.

I know the answer, "buy more RAM it's cheap", from the Atom people, but then my browser people tell me the same thing. So do my interface people, and my kernel people, and by the time I say "okay" to all of them, I'm out of RAM again.

Application need to learn they aren't the only thing running. For some reason, my machine seems to be getting slower and slower no matter how much I upgrade.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#63

Post by roryisok »

coldtea wrote: post #35
chickenfries wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Must every thread about VSCode and Atom start the same way? It's a trade off: performance for a cross platform JavaScript app development. If that is a tradeoff you don't have to make, don't do it. Atom and VSCode have made that tradeoff. I don't know what rehashing this can possibly accomplish.

> Must every thread about VSCode and Atom start the same way If many people believe this is the case, why not? All articles get some common types of responses based on the topic, this is just one topic/response combo that you happen to disagree with. > It's a trade off: performance for a cross platform JavaScript app development. It's an unnecessary tradeoff. If a single developer can create ST from scratch for Windo…

I feel silly asking but what is ST?

Edit: Sublime Text?

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#64

Post by coldtea »

ruleabidinguser wrote: post #58
coldtea wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So as far as actually talking about my point goes, what exactly am I missing? There are small differences but I've never seen a language that I couldn't get up and going in over the course of a week. That's because you either used the languages superficially, or use only very similar languages, probably of the Algol family (e.g. Ruby, Python, PHP, JS, etc). You won't get very far with Haskell "over the course of a…

Well of course you can't include languages like Haskell in the group of interchangeable languages. Incidentally I have used Haskell (and it did take more than a week). But it doesn't matter because we're talking about moving JavaScript developers to Java, or C++, or as you say, Algol-likes.

>Well of course you can't include languages like Haskell in the group of interchangeable languages.

Well, if you can only include "interchangeable languages" then it's not an observation but a tautology.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#65

Post by tree_of_item »

ruleabidinguser wrote: post #50
coldtea wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In my experience all languages are essentially the same. That's the problem: you don't seem to have enough experience.

I dont seem to have much experience? Based on what? For having a different view than you? Isnt that a little naive? So as far as actually talking about my point goes, what exactly am I missing? There are small differences but I've never seen a language that I couldn't get up and going in over the course of a week. How much experience do you think I have? I've used plenty of languages, and I'm well aware that there ar…

> I dont seem to have much experience? Based on what?

Based on the fact that you think all programming languages are essentially the same. That's just a ridiculous claim and it immediately exposes you as someone who's only used a couple of Algol derivatives.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#66

Post by dstaley »

jen20 wrote: post #53
dstaley wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If this was truly that simple, don't you think someone would have already done it? Furthermore, is there even an actively maintained, open source, cross platform, development-focused text editor with native UI components?

IntelliJ does a good job of it without resorting to Electron.

IntelliJ doesn't use native UI components though. Furthermore, Atom can open a single file in 3s, whereas opening the same file in IntelliJ takes 11s (these numbers are from cold starts). This is with clean installs of both IDEs on a 2016 MacBook Pro.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#67

Post by michaelmrose »

penagwin wrote: post #17

I started this issue a long time ago, and it's been frozen since: https://github.com/electron/electron/issues/3041 Maybe now we can have actual source code protection?

Why do you consider it valuable to give people an application and make it harder to debug when it crashes or misbehaves?

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#68

Post by michaelmrose »

bronson wrote: post #34
CJefferson wrote: post #9

I wish atom would just add preloading. I be happy to always have a hidden, sleeping window ready to pop to front on request. There must be some reason this is harder than I imagine...

You can basically do that now: just don't quit. If you start Atom and it discovers that it's already running, it tells the running process to handle the request. It even honors environment variables and flags like --dev. For example, starting Atom cold on my medium-sized project (by running `atom .` in the base dir) takes 6 seconds. If I close all windows but leave Atom running, do something else for a while, and the…

This is really simple procedure that should take like a millisecond why does it take seconds?

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#69

Post by BinaryIdiot »

jnordwick wrote: post #62

I'm way more worried about memory issues while running. Atom take up 1 gig+ with very little open. It pushes all my other tools out of RAM and into swap. Switching to the browser to see documentation takes a few seconds if I'm lucky. Compiling a few more seconds to page in. Ssh a few more. Everything on my laptop slows to a crawl as they fight for RAM with Atom taking up the way more than it should. I know the answer…

> I'm way more worried about memory issues while running.

Same here. Start-up time is important when the average user is hitting a web app or application but for developers? We open something once and then keep it open pretty much all day.

Unless I'm an edge case I'd suspect start-up time is mostly meaningless to developers with long running developer tools.

At the same time we always have tons of tools open at once so we need as much memory as possible because once things hit the swap the performance degrades terribly.

Re: Improving startup time in Atom with V8 snapshots

#70

Post by ruleabidinguser »

coldtea wrote: post #64
ruleabidinguser wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well of course you can't include languages like Haskell in the group of interchangeable languages. Incidentally I have used Haskell (and it did take more than a week). But it doesn't matter because we're talking about moving JavaScript developers to Java, or C++, or as you say, Algol-likes.

> Well of course you can't include languages like Haskell in the group of interchangeable languages. Well, if you can only include "interchangeable languages" then it's not an observation but a tautology.

No kidding? What I was trying to say (I thought I was pretty clear) is that we're really only considering institutional languages here. As it turns out to my knowledge theyre basically all the same.
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