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Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

gizmodo.co.uk

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Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#61

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #47
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #31

It's at least somewhat ironic, though, that the first person profiled in the article is from Norway, as Norway has always rejected EU membership. If you're upset about Britain leaving the EU, "taking your talents back to Norway" makes it sound like EU membership isn't exactly top of your concerns.

> as Norway has always rejected EU membership But Norway is in the European Economic Area, meaning the (all or nothing) agreement for "the free movement of persons, goods, services and capital within the European Single Market". if keeping those freedoms are your concern, then you have every right to prefer Norway over England. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Economic_Area

But negotiations haven't even started between UK and EU over the terms of the exit and what the relationship will look like in 2 years. Seems this article is trying to take a few anecdotes that have a tenuous relationship at best to Brexit being the real root cause of these people leaving.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#63

Post by gonvaled »

s3nnyy wrote: post #48

After Brexit everyone in Zurich thought that all FinTech startups would move from London to Frankfurt or maybe Zurich, since Switzerland has tight relationships with the EU. This did not seem to happen. Also, I haven't gotten more UK people asking me for tech jobs in Zurich compared to before Brexit. (I run a tech recruiting agency; happy to help people who want to move to Switzerland, you finde the recently released…

The UK is a EU member, will full rights and full obligations. Now, and at least for the next two years.

Brexit has not yet happened, by a long stretch of imagination. A letter has been delivered, nothing more and nothing less.

Supply chains have not changed, work rights have not changed, residence and movement rights have not changed, trade costs have not changed, taxation rules have not changed.

The only real change up to now has been the depreciation of the pound. That would mean that less foreign applicants are interested in moving to the UK, but there is less of an argument about whether UK nationals are more interested in moving to the rEU, for two reasons:

- less mobility of UK citizens, because of low proficiency levels in foreign languages

- higher rates / salary in the UK, which still holds even after the devaluation of the pound.

You will not see big changes in a long time, even if Brexit turns out to be a game changer (for the better or worse)

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#64

Post by jacquesm »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #58
jacquesm wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, once that's done as far as I understand it there is no way back, agreement or not, the clock ticks and after 2 years are up the separation is a fact. If people are hoping for a collapse of the Brexit after that point they are delusional, the only way this would reverse after that is by a new application, and I really don't see that ending up with the UK being in a better position after such a process than they…

> Well, once that's done as far as I understand it there is no way back It seems that EU lawmaking bodies disagree with you: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-stop-ar...

That's contrary to this (but more recent, in fact, it isn't law right now):

https://www.businessinsider.nl/uk-supreme-court-article-50-n...

And I note that it requires unanimous agreement between all the other member states, which is a very rare thing. So a very thin maybe.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#65

Post by wayn3 »

s3nnyy wrote: post #48

After Brexit everyone in Zurich thought that all FinTech startups would move from London to Frankfurt or maybe Zurich, since Switzerland has tight relationships with the EU. This did not seem to happen. Also, I haven't gotten more UK people asking me for tech jobs in Zurich compared to before Brexit. (I run a tech recruiting agency; happy to help people who want to move to Switzerland, you finde the recently released…

this is especially silly given the fact that switzerland isnt exactly part of the EU, either.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#66

Post by awjr »

CaptainZapp wrote: post #53
pimmen wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what that means in practice is another thing entirely. For example, the DPRK and the ROK are still at war with each other, but that just means that they stare down each other at a border. The UK could be officially outside of the EU but to the banks, universities and import-export companies EU cooperation is as much of a reality as ever. Really powerful entities want to keep their shareholders happy by avoiding c…

The UK could be officially outside of the EU but to the banks, universities and import-export companies EU cooperation is as much of a reality as ever. That's the wishful thinking so much projected by the brexiteers. And I believe they're very wrong. While London may remain a financial hub it will lose its importance. Multinational banks and insurances are alredy preparing to move entire departments to the continent.…

More interestingly cross border co-operation between engineering companies will become harder. For example a part for the BMW Mini crosses the channel 3 times before being fitted https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/mar/03/brexit-uk-c...

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#67

Post by 67726e »

TorKlingberg wrote: post #8

I know at least one programmer who is leaving the UK because of Brexit. Personally I am staying put and assuming things will work out ok.

Are they truly leaving, actually making plans and the like or did they just say they were going to leave because I heard countless friends talk of leaving for Canada if Trump won and not a damn one did.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#68

Post by cabalamat »

brango wrote: post #50
patrickaljord wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Well, once that's done as far as I understand it there is no way back The UK has 2 year to retract as article 50 allows that. 2 years is a long period in UK politics during which a vote of no-confidence could happen, calling for new elections that could retract article 50. Even if the 2 years pass, the EU already said that they would fast track the UK back in if a future government wants to come back. This is not o…

They'll only let us back in the club if they choose to from now on [1]. Basically, they've left the door open for us to vote in a pro-EU party in the next general election and abandon the whole thing. That's why they won't agree a trade deal in the next 2 years. They're hoping, like me, that things will get sufficiently bad in the next 2 years the public gives a mandate to a pro-EU party, and the whole sorry mess can…

> They'll only let us back in the club if they choose to from now on

I think this is basically correct. I also think that if, before the 2 years are up, the UK changes its mind about Brexit, the EU would be very likely to allow its membership to continue.

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#69

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

s3nnyy wrote: post #48

After Brexit everyone in Zurich thought that all FinTech startups would move from London to Frankfurt or maybe Zurich, since Switzerland has tight relationships with the EU. This did not seem to happen. Also, I haven't gotten more UK people asking me for tech jobs in Zurich compared to before Brexit. (I run a tech recruiting agency; happy to help people who want to move to Switzerland, you finde the recently released…

> This did not seem to happen.

Slowly does it. It would not be fair to say that nothing is happening:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-03-21/goldman-m...

The draft EU position has "no special deal for the City of London" which makes a lot of things moving out of London very likely.

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/mar/29/first-eu-re...

Re: Brexit's Tech Brain Drain

#70

Post by gonvaled »

djmobley wrote: post #23
frostburg wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is anecdotal, but my friends in the UK (typically working on their PhD or medical doctors from the EU) have already encountered open hostility and have little intention to stay to be exploited for their skills without any guarantee.

To be explored for their skills? You mean entering into voluntary paid employment, in a civilized western democracy with some of the highest standards of living in the world?

It seems they are reconsidering, so no, not voluntary. They voluntarily started worked, now things have changed and they do not think that was a good decision.
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