Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups • Hacker News Board

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#61

Post by sneak » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:21 PM UTC

TuringNYC wrote: post #41

The irony here: Some people see studies like this and think, wow, think of how much we'd lose if we didnt let in immigrants. Our economy would be smaller, we'd have fewer jobs, etc. Other people see studies like this and think, wow, only us locals should own, run, and be employed by these Billion-Dollar Startups. Bannon has explicitly noted this as a goal!

This sense of entitlement due to physical proximity of birthplace is completely arbitrary, ridiculous, and counterproductive.

Discriminating on nationality (which most had zero choice in, and was decided for them at birth) is the same as discriminating based on skin color or biological sex. It's just standard anticompetitive in-group/out-group fear-driven nonsense.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#62

Post by rs1234 » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:21 PM UTC

A bunch of folks on this forum love to bash the H1B visa. But that visa is not so new - this is how America has always filled her need for labor. Please take a few moments to read about "indentured servants" - immigrants from Britain and other parts of Europe who came to the US in 1800s. They were required to serve 5 to 7 years working in fields. After that they were given land and free to work for themselves. The H1B visa has similarities. Guess what is the duration of stay for a H1B visa? 6 years. During this time they are pretty much tied to the company that sponsored their visa. After that they are given the green card, which lets them work for any company.

http://www.encyclopediavirginia.org/Indentured_Servants_in_C...

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#63

Post by sillysaurus3 » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:21 PM UTC

bayesian_horse wrote: post #32

One of the basic premises of anti-immigrant policies is that you can somehow influence the ratio of "useful" vs "not-useful" immigrants. Apart from the idea of sorting people into useful and useless being inhumane, it also seems to be counterproductive. It looks like every kind of screening of immigrants will deter the more desirable ones, as far as that determination is possible on their arrival at all.

Apart from the idea of sorting people into useful and useless being inhumane, it also seems to be counterproductive.

Universities do it.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#64

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:22 PM UTC

cromwellian wrote: post #18

Cuuugi wrote: post #10

Whenever I see "Immigration" in the title, i think anti-Trump and get sad. No one is trying to stop legal immigration. Tech companies are mad because they are cracking down on H1-B Visa abuse. This is not a bad thing.

Really? Than why so many leaked memos show that Bannon and Miller want to reduce family Visas for those already legally here? Why is Bannon and Miller's favorite novel a racist French book about Europe becoming less white? Why when Bannon was interviewed on radio he said he wanted to bring the numbers on legal immigration way down? You're fooling yourself if you think this is just about undocumented Mexicans, Muslims…

[deleted]

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#65

Post by elastic_church » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:23 PM UTC

pm90 wrote: post #27

cromwellian wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Really? Than why so many leaked memos show that Bannon and Miller want to reduce family Visas for those already legally here? Why is Bannon and Miller's favorite novel a racist French book about Europe becoming less white? Why when Bannon was interviewed on radio he said he wanted to bring the numbers on legal immigration way down? You're fooling yourself if you think this is just about undocumented Mexicans, Muslims…

First they came for the "Illegals"... Rhetoric aside, as you pointed out, this is only the beginning. Authoritarians always need a scrapegoat to blame for "failed policies". Once one group is eliminated, on to another.

First they came for the illegals but I didn't speak up because my 401k has been making massive gains and this whole administration has been awesome for me but I can't say that out loud in California because people are still imagining a reason to lose their minds while the checks and balances are working out as intended the whole time!

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#66

Post by 24gttghh » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:23 PM UTC

jlebrech wrote: post #44

pm90 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First they came for the "Illegals"... Rhetoric aside, as you pointed out, this is only the beginning. Authoritarians always need a scrapegoat to blame for "failed policies". Once one group is eliminated, on to another.

this is also called the slippery slope fallacy.

This is also called history repeating/rhyming with itself.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#67

Post by capocannoniere » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:23 PM UTC

I assume what they really mean by Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups is that 51% of $1B+ U.S. startups have at least one immigrant founder, right? (as opposed to 51% of unicorn founders are immigrants)

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#68

Post by hvmonk » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:24 PM UTC

Who exactly is not an immigrant in the states? If one traverse lineage of any of these so called "non-immigrants", within 3-4 generations one will see they were an immigrant too.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#69

Post by omarforgotpwd » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:24 PM UTC

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #63

bayesian_horse wrote: post #32

One of the basic premises of anti-immigrant policies is that you can somehow influence the ratio of "useful" vs "not-useful" immigrants. Apart from the idea of sorting people into useful and useless being inhumane, it also seems to be counterproductive. It looks like every kind of screening of immigrants will deter the more desirable ones, as far as that determination is possible on their arrival at all.

Apart from the idea of sorting people into useful and useless being inhumane, it also seems to be counterproductive. Universities do it.

There are many alternatives if you are denied from a university, such as applying to a different university or learning online instead. There is only one America

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#70

Post by cromwellian » Mon, Mar 13, 2017, 4:25 PM UTC

jlebrech wrote: post #44

pm90 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First they came for the "Illegals"... Rhetoric aside, as you pointed out, this is only the beginning. Authoritarians always need a scrapegoat to blame for "failed policies". Once one group is eliminated, on to another.

this is also called the slippery slope fallacy.

It's not when there's already evidence that we're slipping down the slope. We have verbal interviews of Steve Bannon's intent and philosophy and leaked drafts of policies aimed at slashing legal immigration by 50%.

Supporters of Trump and his policies go out of their way to try and soften and explain what he "really" means by saying to ignore what he or his advisors literally say. I think this is dangerously naive and the time is past giving the benefit of the doubt and sticking to rigid logical standards. This isn't philosophy class and this stuff poses real world dangers.