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Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

nautil.us

61–70 of 208 posts

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#61
post #20

Every time I read one of these articles about genius and madness, I become smug for a little while, then I get depressed because I realize that I haven't accomplished anything noteworthy, then I'm mildly reassured because occasionally my wife will spontaneously aver (contrary to all expectation) that I am a genius, then I get distracted and start chasing some ideas, then I get depressed again because, well, shit, I s…

You seem to have a fixation on the idea of genius. You are susceptible to momentarily convincing yourself​ that you're a genius, which is followed by feelings of inadequacy. Why don't you try to put this genius idea out of your head? Convince yourself that you are probably not a genius, but that's ok because you do your best. You may have to grieve for a bit as the loss of your genius fantasy sinks in. If you feel a…

Oh, how many times have I done this. I think it is a side-effect of growing up in a time when the idea of genius was especially promoted, and also of being raised by parents who were teachers and who thought geniuses were important.

Thankfully, I have a good counterbalance of extensive readings in philosophy and theology.

Now, for a real sense of loss, two days ago the grandmother of my best childhood friend died. She raised him since his mother was about 15 or 16 when he was born, and she was one of those influential adults from my childhood. She was 93.

I happened to be taking a driving trip from Iowa (where I was raised -- yes, by Swedish parents) to the east coast, so on the way I drove through the tiny town where I grew up. (I grew up with the people who made Templeton Rye when it was still bootleg. I recognize the people on the label, even though I haven't seen most of them for 40 years.)

When I drove out to my childhood best friend's farm (a mile outside of town), only two of the outbuildings were still standing. The barn is gone. The house is gone and the basement has been filled in and grass is growing there. Some of the old trees have been cut down. Even the old hand pump that was in front of the house is gone. (It worked when I was a kid.)

It's ridiculous, I suppose, but I cried, and I'm not at all what you might call "a crier." The memories were so thick and so . . . not painful, but acute. I am cursed with an extremely good memory. The sense of loss, or really I suppose the sense of the contrast of difference between reality and the ideal in my memory, made me cry.

I think that is what accounts for that sense that perhaps one is a genius: 1) the desire to be a genius, in order to impress your dead parents or perhaps your peers who have inordinate reverence for genius; 2) a better than average memory that creates a deep sense of time; 3) sensitivity to change; 4) as the article points out, noticing things others ignore.

Now that I'm mildly buzzed, I'm going to work on creating a triple boot of LinuxMint, Manjaro, and OpenSUSE on this shitty little ThinkPad T60 made in 2006 since the wifi has quit working with OpenBSD. I'm too tired to figure out why, and I've never tried any of these Linux distros, and who says doing stupid stuff like this is only for teenagers?

Please forgive me for drunken rambling on a Saturday night. I promise I won't do it again for at least a year.

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#62
post #31
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For some reason (probably my whiskey) your self aggrandizing comment was quite entertaining even though normally I'm put off by "I am very smart" posts.

I detest "I am very smart" posts. I just came back to delete my bullshit comment, but I have decided to let it ride because of your kind words. I am glad you found it entertaining. Hopefully I won't hate myself in the morning for not deleting it. :^0 P.S. I really don't think I am a genius, just to be clear.

Well then you have a clear chance of being a genius, since according to other threads those who think they're a genius aren't!

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are all capable. Most of us just choose to drink our whiskey instead of leveling up to achieve something everyone will hear about.

The value of whiskey is pretty clear, the value of notability much less so.

Hear, hear!

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#64
post #51
post #20

Every time I read one of these articles about genius and madness, I become smug for a little while, then I get depressed because I realize that I haven't accomplished anything noteworthy, then I'm mildly reassured because occasionally my wife will spontaneously aver (contrary to all expectation) that I am a genius, then I get distracted and start chasing some ideas, then I get depressed again because, well, shit, I s…

why do you care if you accomplish something noteworthy?

Please see rambling reply to another poster.

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#65
post #48

You have a personality disorder. Please see a psychiatrist.

Oh, I have seen several psychiatrists and psychologists and counselors over the years. They're generally pleasant but useless people, though a couple of them provided perspectives and comments that were useful at the time.

The biggest help has been that I no longer value social acceptance so highly. It's terrible, I know. Feel free to call me an obnoxious asshole if it helps you. Several have and I've survived.

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#66

As a public figure, it wasn't worth burning my reputation to type this out, but I think that speaks to the state of discourse around mental health today. The article is uses the word "psychopathology" which is a general term for the study of mental disorders. However I want to talk specifically about Psychopathy as a disorder, because I recently came to understand that I am a psychopath. My guess is that there are pr…

Thank you for posting this; I'm not a public figure, but quickly rising through the ranks of a Fortune 500 corporation -- maybe through skill, or maybe manipulation, I've honestly lost track at this point. I wouldn't consider myself "genius", but definitely above average, and people that "know" me tell me I'm too smart for my own good. I've slowly come to realize that I am what would be considered sociopathic, I find it incredibly difficult to feel empathy, and to form deep relationships (especially intimate ones), most of it is due to logic, that I time and time again I ask myself "why should I care?" and most of the time I can't answer that question. In that sense it is a handicap, sometimes I have periods of crushing loneliness but then quite quickly I can rationalize it into a strength, that I am not bound by human needs and can leverage that to grasp total control, to make money, etc. You do learn to fake a lot of it, you have to, but I find myself slipping sometimes in public by dropping some line and catching some strange looks, thankfully people chalk it up to my "eccentricity." That made my childhood a bit difficult, because at that age you don't even know what is supposed to be normal, but quickly you realize that you're supposed to feel happy in these situations, but in other you need to appear somber. The sheer idea that I needed to "think" about how to act in certain situations, and eventually realizing that others don't do that was certainly difficult, not in the sense of remorse or anything but rather realizing that you are a total outsider look in. I find that slowly revealing who you are can work sometimes, up to a point, before people start to get scared.

It's also interesting to see some people to think that I'm judging them or remotely care about their existence, when in reality I simply don't care about them at all; I think I told my parents that once, which was met by a strange reactions (guess I won't say it again).

To me it seems all perfectly rational and normal; Why would you care about other people? Why not live for yourself? Why not take advantage of other to further your interests? Life has to meaning, so any meaning you assign is just as equally valid. As I continue to interact with people that have no ambition, that are afraid to do something because it might hurt other people the more I fall into the idea that most people are cattle to be taken advantage of by the likes of GP, Trump, Bankers, and others;

And yeah in the end you do realize that you are broken and ugly, that you will never be like the others. If I had any regrets I'd say its not being able to enjoy love as others do, especially when I was younger. But I simply can't see the reason why I would want to do that, there is very little utility, and I feel like it would only slow me down (although having a partner that shares my world view would be nice -- a la Mr Robot's Evil Corp CTO -- but finding that person is difficult since that would require us both disclosing our true personalities).

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#67
post #5

I'm surprised Hemmingway was used as an example in this piece. He did believe he was being monitored or 'stalked' by the FBI. His wife/family did have him subjected to electro-shock therapy. Wasn't it later proven that Hemmingway was followed and 'harrassed' by the FBI?

He did go hunting for U-boats in the English Channel with a shotgun and a dinghy in WWII.

I guess that may or may not have been particularly abnormal in Britain at the time, though.

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#68

As a public figure, it wasn't worth burning my reputation to type this out, but I think that speaks to the state of discourse around mental health today. The article is uses the word "psychopathology" which is a general term for the study of mental disorders. However I want to talk specifically about Psychopathy as a disorder, because I recently came to understand that I am a psychopath. My guess is that there are pr…

Thanks for starting this conversation.

I come from a different starting point, with similar results though.

I'm very emotion driven most of the time, getting out of my way to understand how people feel or think, empathizing with their angst. However I soon learned that many of these characteristics are seen by many as 'weak', and this was impairing my ability to get social advantages.

At the same time, the process of hearing and trying to understand leverages your advantage, as you may grasp the hidden desires of people. If the other person is not engaged in the same profound way, of understanding the dialogue, you end up in a position of power.

I identified very much with the expressions 'robot' and 'playing a character 24 hours a day' because that's how I learned to be more comfortable.

It's really hard to break this chain, that keeps reinforced by the narratives you create yourself, of how you should be seen or perceived, and used as a rationalization (just or not) of happenings on your environment (e.g. as a self-fulfilling prophecy).

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#69
post #20

Every time I read one of these articles about genius and madness, I become smug for a little while, then I get depressed because I realize that I haven't accomplished anything noteworthy, then I'm mildly reassured because occasionally my wife will spontaneously aver (contrary to all expectation) that I am a genius, then I get distracted and start chasing some ideas, then I get depressed again because, well, shit, I s…

I used to feel the same way. What changed? My brother died. Dropped dead. I realized that life is not only short but fragile. I started to work on improving my life one step at a time. Wanting things to happen overnight but knowing that takes time. Sometimes losing faith but never losing focus on the end goal. I want to to not waste my life. Forget being smart or doing something big. I don't want to regret wasting it…

Yes, I agree. I do not spend all my Saturday evenings in this state. In fact, it's quite rare, and 99% of the time, I am very content and reasonably focused on accomplishing good things for my family, friends, and society at large.

P.S. I am very sorry to hear that you lost your brother. That must be painful.

Re: Both geniuses and madmen pay attention to what others ignore

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean as a complex biological system phenomenon genius is unstable a bit like unstable weather phenomenon. We don't have windstorms all the time but every so often global currents and temperatures line up and we get one. I imagine genius is a bit like that at the genetic level. I think genius can be nurtured and as a society we can make better use of all our geniuses but I don't think it can be taught. It really has…

So you think genius is genetic, but mystically uninheritable? Interesting perspective.

There is nothing mystical about it. It is possible for something to be genetically predetermined without being heritable in any meaningful way because the underlying genetic patterns are unstable. Going back to my windstorm example, windstorms don't last long because the energy inherent in the storm basically rips it apart.

You keep glossing over that fact for some reason.

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