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The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

economist.com

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Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#61
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a while, I had thought that the modern world had finally transcended the grip of medieval-minded ignorance. But the medievals didn't go away, and they eventually organized and voted and, in the U.S., got lucky with a system that disproportionately allocates presidential voting power, allowing the GOP to win 3 out of the past 7 elections despite having won the vote only once.

Nation states are an invention of the 19th century. Give the Middle Ages more credit.

Surely the U.S.A. (a 1776 result of the scientific Enlightenment responsible for every single improvement to human life, assuming that you don't want to be a disease-ridden illiterate peasant lucky to make it to your 30's) meets any reasonable categorization of a nation-state.

46% of Americans believe that humans were created in their current form sometime in the last 10,000 years by a Bronze Age deity fond of stoning. Don't even start trying to convince me that the medieval world is behind us.

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#62
post #56

The reason being that the US still requires visas from 5 EU countries: Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland and Romania. And "The EU says it notified the United States in April 2014 that it was not meeting EU visa rules, and had given the country two years to comply."

what most likely would happen as most of these agreements is full reciprocity. i.e., like Europeans have to pay $14 for the ESTA visa waiver to travel in the US, Americans would have to do the same and register online. That visa waiver would hopefully work for the entire E.U. Or, like Australia, Brunei, Japan, and Canada which were similarly notified and implemented the changes, the US will do the same. http://www.in…

Can we do full reciprocity in terms of taxes and tariffs on imports?

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#63
The global citizen in me laughs at this decision.

The revengeful soul in me hails it (being married to an Iranian women that should currently better not sei a foot there and myself needing a visa because I visit Iran regularily).

The European citizen that I am takes a deep breath of calm as he knows that this was "only" a decision in the parliament, so probably not much will happen in real life.

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#64
post #6

What is going on in this world? I was reading news today that the parties on the right side of political spectrum are gaining ground all over Europe. US already has Republicans in power. Every country is becoming more nationalistic. What is driving this change? AFAICT there are no major issues that should have caused this.

> AFAICT there are no major issues that should have caused this.

Globalization, the rise of the precariat, anemic economic recovery since the recession for the lower and middle classes, justified and unjustified distrust in institutions, better use of technology and propaganda by the right, poor quality of liberal/centerist establishment candidates...

But besides that, no, nothing is driving this phenomena.

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#65
post #6

What is going on in this world? I was reading news today that the parties on the right side of political spectrum are gaining ground all over Europe. US already has Republicans in power. Every country is becoming more nationalistic. What is driving this change? AFAICT there are no major issues that should have caused this.

> What is driving this change?

Financialization of the banking sector and globalisation[1] happened. Socialists in Europe and the US (if you like to call democrats socialists...) failed miserably to address any of the above in a meaningful way, so we're in 1929 all over again.

[1] Money can move freely across borders now but not people ;-)

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#66
post #49
post #6

What is going on in this world? I was reading news today that the parties on the right side of political spectrum are gaining ground all over Europe. US already has Republicans in power. Every country is becoming more nationalistic. What is driving this change? AFAICT there are no major issues that should have caused this.

As others have stated here, this is largely a reaction to globalization and immigration issues that have been present in the world's view. Globalization has left a large portion of each country behind. Large multinational firms have moved a lot of their low-skill labor to cheaper markets and developing countries, leaving a large swath of former employees in their wake with very little perceived hope of finding anothe…

> In another comment section (Reddit, I believe) there was anecdotal evidence that visitors from Bulgaria, Croatia, Cyprus, Poland and Romania regularly outstayed their visas and were notorious for violating a tourist visa, hence the additional checks the US wanted to put them through.

I guess it was anecdotal evidence, because the data shows the contrary:

- Bulgaria: 1.74% - Croatia: 1.08% - Cyprus: 1.35% - Poland: 1.49% - Romania: 2.06%

There are a few countries on the VWP that have higher overstaying ratios (Hungary, Chile, Slovakia). Croatia in particular has an overstaying ratio lower than Austria's and Netherlands'. Source: https://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/FY%2015...

The reason they don't get VWP is the visa refusal rate, aka "US embassy in your country does not want to give you visa".

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#67
post #40

Yeah... Not going to happen. Americans spend billions on European vacations, and nobody is going to threaten that when push comes to shove (any additional hassle is going to send people to Cancun instead). This is just posturing.

For me to go on vacation to the US, as a European citizen (outside of the 6 countries that are the reason for this action), I just need to get an ESTA for $15 or so. I guess the EU visa will cost something similar. It's not going to change anything.

there's around 12 million travelers* from the US to Europe every year, so if a ESTA-reciprocity is implemented, it'll bring around $180m of revenue to European immigration offices.

* that's only counting leisure travelers, there might be many more business travelers?

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#68
post #6

What is going on in this world? I was reading news today that the parties on the right side of political spectrum are gaining ground all over Europe. US already has Republicans in power. Every country is becoming more nationalistic. What is driving this change? AFAICT there are no major issues that should have caused this.

Are you serious? It is largely a reaction to globalization and the refugee crisis.

This is such FUD.

How would preventing US citizens from coming to the EU prevent African and Middle Eastern refugees to come to Europe?

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#69
post #19

The sooner the EU dissolves, the better.

That's what Putin says.

> That's what Putin says.

If Putin says something, it's wrong? I guess that's a good way to reason if you don't want to think for yourself.

Re: The European Parliament votes non-bindingly to reintroduce visas for Americans

#70
post #40

Yeah... Not going to happen. Americans spend billions on European vacations, and nobody is going to threaten that when push comes to shove (any additional hassle is going to send people to Cancun instead). This is just posturing.

For me to go on vacation to the US, as a European citizen (outside of the 6 countries that are the reason for this action), I just need to get an ESTA for $15 or so. I guess the EU visa will cost something similar. It's not going to change anything.

ESTA is a officially a visa-waiver program that is supposed to be free.

I seriously doubt that an actual visa will be as cheap.

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