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Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

economist.com

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Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#61

The province could pass a law that allowing them to seize the assets of a foreign owner who does not occupy or rent their residence. Have this law apply to companies that hold single-family residence as well. If it passes legal muster, the threat of losing your property is probably enough to dissuade a lot of foreign investors.

Wouldn't that also harm anyone with a vacation property?

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A bubble is a more complex phenomenon than large price increases. A bubble is inflated by speculation that isn't rooted in anything except the rising price. If rich foreigners are buying property to summer in because they like the weather, then not a bubble. If rich foreigners are buying property because the property has gained X% in price every year for the last ten years but they don't know anything about the speci…

A bubble is inflated by speculation that isn't rooted in anything except the rising price. It's been like that for the last 8+ years.

You are trivializing how difficult it is to determine this. For example, is the empty mansion empty because someone is speculating with it or because a globe trotting billionaire forgot he bought it?

I'm sure there is speculation going on in the market, but we can't tell to what degree without polling the people buying real estate.

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#63

The province could pass a law that allowing them to seize the assets of a foreign owner who does not occupy or rent their residence. Have this law apply to companies that hold single-family residence as well. If it passes legal muster, the threat of losing your property is probably enough to dissuade a lot of foreign investors.

Wouldn't that also harm anyone with a vacation property?

It would harm a lot of people. But the problem they are trying to solve is foreign investment driving up property prices. The best way to attack his problem is to prevent or discourage foreign investors from buying residential homes.

The good thing is this kind of law can be adjudicated, unlike the tax. Because you can go before a judge/mediator and argue that you use the home as a residence.

The current tax scheme just hurts foreigners that live and work in Canada, not the people who buy up million dollar properties (which is exactly who the law intends to target).

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#64

I live in Canada and basically Vancouver, possibly the Canadian city with the nicest weather, is completely cut off to me. It's not even like Silicon Valley etc where there is an industry and you can find a job that pays better here, it's just completely too expensive. There was a website called something like "crack house or million dollar Vancouver home" because knock-down quality bungalows were selling for over a…

You could rent. Rental prices in Vancouver are fairly reasonable relative to purchase prices.

Trying to rent in Vancouver is insane. Lat time I looked I had to schedule to look at places in groups. It takes mere hours for a rental to go from an AD to rented. Bidding wars are becoming more common. Top it off with the "renoviction" phenomenon and it all makes renting in Vancouver very difficult.

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#65

The Canadian housing market is currently in a bubble. The same can be said about the Australian housing market. Canada http://i.huffpost.com/gen/1100960/thumbs/o-BMO-HOUSE-PRICES-... http://static5.businessinsider.com/image/54aea0136da8118f2ae... Australia https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-NuIUphAP17w/Vth6P3w2FzI/AAAAAAAAC... http://www.propertyobserver.com.au/images/stories/keenjan2.p...

(I posted this in a previous article.) You really should include a link to this as well- Real Estate Board of Greater Vancouver MLS Home Price Index http://www.rebgv.org/home-price-index?region=all&type=all&da... This shows the the price trend of Detached, Townhouse, and Apartment up to the last 11 years, broken by individual cities in Greater Vancouver. But it is misleading. If you look at Metro Vancouver's trend, a…

https://shawglobalnews.files.wordpress.com/2016/07/chart.png

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#66
post #47

If foreign investors are happily buying "overpriced" properties at huge premiums, why not simply build more?

Because you'll never build enough. Global demand surpasses potential local supply by a huge margin. Prices won't even begin to drop.

Vancouver is Canada, with lots of undeveloped spaces available. It is not Manhattan or Hong Kong (not that Manhattan is some sacred land too that everybody should live there). It can be safely increased in size many times.

But some might say this will drive property prices down? Mission accomplished!

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly what came to my mind. I saw this same behavior happening in 2005. When there is no marketable cash-flow producing use of investment property, you are in a bubble.

And the phenomenon is even worse now. If you sold a property in 2005 in Vancouver, I bet you wish you'd held on to it. As someone else said, it's only a bubble when it pops. Good luck timing that.

[deleted]

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#68
post #25

Wonder if San Francisco could do the same to these foreign real estate squatters.

The tax only really affects landed immigrants who live and work in BC, and foreign capital investments in new developments as the Chinese speculators with billions who want to park money in Vancouver have already found ways around it because they can deposit millions to set up national corporations and have it do all the land holding/flipping. For example my sister who has lived here 30yrs with American citizenship w…

Detached houses appreciated at least 30% last year though. [1] Yes, some folks may face a tax hit if they cash out and rebuy but it's hardly disastrous.

[1] http://www.theglobeandmail.com/real-estate/vancouver/ten-yea...

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forgive me because I don't know how to blockquote here, this is the definition of "investment" from the agreement you linked: 1. “investment” means: (a) an enterprise; (b) shares, stocks and other forms of equity participation in an enterprise; (c) bonds, debentures, and other debt instruments of an enterprise; (d) a loan to an enterprise (i) where the enterprise is an affiliate of the investor, or (ii) where the ori…

First, please don't use fixed-width font to quote -- it makes users have to scroll horizontally to see it all. Second, I'm not a lawyer either, but it seems as a Canadian property investor, you could make your case with several items in the above list: (f) an interest in an enterprise that entitles the owner to share in the income or profits of the enterprise; (g) an interest in an enterprise that entitles the owner…

I cut and pasted from the reg and used 4 spaces on each line to indent. Let me know if there's a better way.

You're right that you could use (f) and (g) to sidestep, but an interest in an enterprise is something resembling equity. So yeah, set up a domestic shell corp, capitalize it, put your real estate in it, and that's probably good to go - I'm generalizing, but you're right. But being able to structure around a particular tax is not the same as the particular tax not applying or not existing. If for whatever Canadian legal reasons liability pierces the entity and goes back to the principals, you have a tax problem. I'm sure there are ways to structure around that as well, but again, I'm way out of my element on Canadian law.

As for (j) that's going to depend on whether Canadian law interprets "immovable property" as real property or not, and then what constitutes business purposes. I'll venture a guess that if a foreigner buys a home, assuming immovable property = real property for (j), and rents it out at market rates at arms length, that's okay. Buying it so their kids can live in it, or "renting" it to relatives or anything other than market rate and arms-length is probably less okay.

I also don't know enough about Canadian jurisprudence and the propensity to enforce the spirit of a law rather than the black letter. So basically I'm a dog pretending to be a Canadian lawyer on the internet. But those are the issues to me. It's certainly arguable from both positions.

Re: Foreign residential property buyers to be taxed at 15% in Vancouver

#70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

First, please don't use fixed-width font to quote -- it makes users have to scroll horizontally to see it all. Second, I'm not a lawyer either, but it seems as a Canadian property investor, you could make your case with several items in the above list: (f) an interest in an enterprise that entitles the owner to share in the income or profits of the enterprise; (g) an interest in an enterprise that entitles the owner…

I cut and pasted from the reg and used 4 spaces on each line to indent. Let me know if there's a better way. You're right that you could use (f) and (g) to sidestep, but an interest in an enterprise is something resembling equity. So yeah, set up a domestic shell corp, capitalize it, put your real estate in it, and that's probably good to go - I'm generalizing, but you're right. But being able to structure around a p…

As far as quoting, I'd do one of these:

- Prefix each line with ">".

- Surround the quotation with triple quotes, like Python:

"""

My long quotation

"""

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