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I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

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Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#61
post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't seen enough of the universe to feel confident that I'm correct in my atheism, and I haven't felt the hand of Nothing touch my heart and send me out to evangelize It.

Would you like a phrase to quickly and easily describe that state of being? Apatheistic Agnostic. You're not concerned with the issue, it's too big and universal and we're too human. You're not convinced of anything, and frankly, since whatever does or doesn't come after this is inevitable and inescapable, what's the point of endless debate during our finite lives? Who knows?... and who could even know? No one, that'…

How does this fit with the assertion that there is no evidence that the supernatural interacts with the natural in any measurable (and hence meaningful) way?

It seems related, but stronger:

"I don't know if there exists supernatural, however I have no reason to believe the supernatural will ever effect me."

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is the party coming to your door that does the evangelizing and I've yet to have an atheist ring my doorbell.

Right, but to pretend that it doesn't happen in common conversation is absurd. Atheists frequently evangelize. It is a religious belief.

Calling atheism a religious belief is as disingenuous as describing science as a religion.

It is possible to be religious in your science-based beliefs, but that does not make science itself a religion. If someone believes something only because "scientists" said so then they share many of the qualities of religions. I would shy away from calling even this a religion, however, as these people are willing to change their belief if the scientific consensus changes.

Furthermore, merely evangelising is not enough to make something a religious belief and it would be an abuse of the language to conflate them in that way. It is completely reasonable to evangelise scientific ideas, and it would be wrong to label that act as a religious one.

Atheism is not science, but it shares a common tenet; both atheists and scientists are willing to change their belief if shown appropriate evidence. Atheists can evangelise for many reasons, but those reasons need not be religious. For example, atheists may believe that religious teachings promote the worst aspects of tribalism and actively harm our society. An atheist can evangelise that the argument "My god is better than your god" is a pointless source of discontent in the world, and want to remove the source of that discontent, without being religious.

Of course, there will be people who shout "you're wrong because SCIENCE!!" but the religious nature of those people doesn't magically transfer to the beliefs they hold simply because they hold them.

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#63
post #49
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I engage Jehovah's Witnesses, but not in the dick way that capital A Atheists might (I'm a small a atheist). I try to learn what they're about. They're generally nice people.

what do you hope to gain by talking to them? I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it? I will try to explain why t…

It's not a mental illness to have faith in something. Faith is a normal part of being human. Even atheists have faith: Faith in their own belief that there are no gods or other supernatural beings. They don't have empirical evidence that there are no higher beings, just as religious types don't have empirical evidence that such beings exist. On a smaller scale, one can have faith in one's own abilities or those of the people around them. Once again, not a mental illness.

Now, I'll concede that religion is a manmade concept, usually a way for those who seek power over others to achieve it. But faith and religion are two completely different things. There are those who believe in a higher power (God? Gods? Spirits? Aliens? Cthulhu?) who are anti-religion, just as there are those who have no true faith in a higher power but use religion to further an agenda (militant extremists and terrorists come to mind, both foreign and domestic).

To put it another way, religion is an institution, faith is human nature. You have faith in the words you wrote; does that make you mentally ill? No, of course not, you just come off as having a huge chip on your shoulder and a predisposition for painting everyone in a billions-strong group with the same brush.

But that's a typical human flaw, not a documented mental illness.

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#64
post #49
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I engage Jehovah's Witnesses, but not in the dick way that capital A Atheists might (I'm a small a atheist). I try to learn what they're about. They're generally nice people.

what do you hope to gain by talking to them? I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it? I will try to explain why t…

> I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it?

I can't speak for the other poster, nor for a capital/lowercase distinction, but your own distinction fails to include me.

To me, religion inhabits a spectrum ranging from vague reverence for the numinous, through stories (either parable or claimed history) told for moral direction, to cynical, doctrinaire oppression. I have directly experienced some of each category (though not the most extreme of the oppressive end). That latter category absolutely affects me, both in terms of solidarity and threat of future expansion, and it absolutely deserves a rigorous fight. The rest is not so cut and dry, and some of it certainly does deserve to be not just allowed to "pass" but to be protected.

With that said...

> what do you hope to gain by talking to them?

A lot can be gained by talking to people you disagree with, even people you fiercely oppose. Aside from the other poster's excellent answer ("I like to be friendly with my neighbors, if not actual friends"), engaging ideas that you don't share is a good cure for your own ignorance and may provide ammunition for the battles actually worth having.

> don't let them in. keep them very far away from you.

Your post suggests that you go beyond your claim that religion is a "mental illness", that you seem to believe said illness is contagious even to the unafflicted. Have a little more confidence in your convictions!

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#65
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you like a phrase to quickly and easily describe that state of being? Apatheistic Agnostic. You're not concerned with the issue, it's too big and universal and we're too human. You're not convinced of anything, and frankly, since whatever does or doesn't come after this is inevitable and inescapable, what's the point of endless debate during our finite lives? Who knows?... and who could even know? No one, that'…

How does this fit with the assertion that there is no evidence that the supernatural interacts with the natural in any measurable (and hence meaningful) way? It seems related, but stronger: "I don't know if there exists supernatural, however I have no reason to believe the supernatural will ever effect me."

You sort of have to come to that conclusion before you start down the apatheist road, I think. After all, any supernatural force that can predictably alter your world is going to rapidly become your god.

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#66
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then if you have UAC (or whatever it's called) turned on, you'll get a warning that the .exe you're about to run is unsigned, right?

It is not an exe. But even without UAC, there is another layer of warnings that has been there since XP SP2 for unsafe file types downloaded from the Internet.

Huh, I never thought about that mainly being protection against the use-case of not realising you downloaded/opened an executable, which is actually quite realistic for the slightly less computer-confident. That makes it a much more acceptable feature.

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#67
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what do you hope to gain by talking to them? I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it? I will try to explain why t…

It's not a mental illness to have faith in something. Faith is a normal part of being human. Even atheists have faith: Faith in their own belief that there are no gods or other supernatural beings. They don't have empirical evidence that there are no higher beings, just as religious types don't have empirical evidence that such beings exist. On a smaller scale, one can have faith in one's own abilities or those of th…

i really liked your reply :)

while I agree I think faith is a bit more than just human nature, I think it's a mechanism developed over centuries to deal with the unknown while our minds continued to expand to understand the unknown.

I think of it as a bug, maybe a little hack that was put in to deal with situations that defy explanation. it helps us come up with explanations, it has a function to deal with unexplained events without loosing our mental model of the world.

faith is like a shim, there is a piece of a mental model that doesn't exist and doesn't fit with your platform, so faith exists as a way into shim that difference into your code base.

religion is code that takes advantage of the shim. however religion is a virus and it takes over your other mental faculties, weakening them. introducing functions that make no sense, but will continue to run until your mind finds a place for them.

there are several ways to take advantage of the faith bug but you can see patterns for different types of systems that use faith hooks to make calls to your reason centers and overrides their output. the more these calls override the reason centers the less they are used.

now the point at which the faith bug is the most susceptible to being utilized is during the brains formative years, and this tactic is used incredibly frequently.

so I see and agree with your point that religion is an institution and faith is a function of humanity, but faith is a bug that can be patched and I also would argue that faith is too broad a term for the reasoning functionality of the brain.

faith is a good word to use when we lack the proper terms, but personal and religious faith are a small subset of the entire faith function and I think it needs to be broken up into its requisite parts.

and maybe the overall function that applies to religion in context to faith is world-model_update(previous_model, new_viewpoint, contextual_conviction/external_conviction) and It seems to me that there is early injection malware in religious code and buffer overflow tricks when you can't get the early injection code to work.

thanks for the reply :)

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#68
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

what do you hope to gain by talking to them? I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it? I will try to explain why t…

> I'm assuming that by capital A, versus lowercase a; atheists, you are trying to underscore the differences between people who understand that religion is a hoax but it doesn't affect me right now so I'll let it pass, and those who have been directly affected by religion and it's evils and see no other way but to fight it as hard as they push it? I can't speak for the other poster, nor for a capital/lowercase distin…

thank you for your answer :)

as far as; is it contagious? yes, it's incredibly contagious, in the sense of a virus and how viruses are spread.

We have two immune systems in our minds, logic and fear.

Logic tells me when something is feasible. and fear tells me when it's not.

religion overrides logic with fear to hook into your faith subroutine and take it over.

everyone is susceptible to this attack, but those who are poor, hungry and desperate for something better are more susceptible than others.

so while talking to your neighbors is good and all, you and your kids are now more susceptible to attack and all it will take is getting you when you're at your weakest, and they'll be there, waiting. it sounds more nefarious than you think it is, but they, like men with women, are only there for a single reason. theirs is different but singular as well: to infect your mind with fear and self doubt and open the way for religion to come in and take over.

and once it does and your fully in, it doesn't matter if you change your mind later, because now you have to change your families minds, and they may be more affected than you depending on their defenses. and kids have none. and so now you're stuck and you make excuses and stick up for your lapse in judgement and infect others because you're totally bought in.

I've seen it too many times for it to be a one off. I've been told by so many religious men that they are only in it because their wife/family is. but they don't understand that by letting it happen they're creating Another generation of logically weakened humans.

and therein is my issue, religion makes us weaker, easier to dominate and placate. religion is a virus.

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#69
post #57

* Disclosure: I used to work for Facebook's security team and focused on threats that impacted users on the platform. * The post outlines in some detail a common attack done by some actors known as BePush/Killim. I made a request for help in fighting these clowns months ago on a private security working group. Here's the post below which outlines a good amount of detail about the hacks and motives. If you are interes…

Thanks for the info. Technically speaking, posting a link on Facebook and tagging a friend to it seems impossible, unless some manipulation or a flaw was presented. Can you confirm or not that Facebook is somehow vulnerable to tagging to links (not posts)

Re: I was tricked on Facebook into downloading an obfuscated script

#70
post #30
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Additionally, if you're the emergency contact and I don't answer and you immediately call back, I'll probably pick up. I don't normally block numbers, just let them voicemail me if I don't recognize it, but if a spammer will double-call like that I'll block them, and it means I'll pick up for emergencies.

How can you block them? The whole point is that spammers call from unknown numbers. Double calling is just an annoying arms race.

Both iOS and Android have various blocking methods, usually built into the OS.

They do not prevent the network from connecting to you, only prevent your device from triggering during the call, instead it will be silently ignored.

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