Aren't warm countries incredibly suitable for solar power? I assume most of the electricity is used during the day for things like electric motors during the work hours and air-conditioning. So they don't need to store that energy to keep homes warm during the colder night (even if residential AC is kept running during the night it will consume less energy since the temperatures will fall)
Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
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Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#62Interesting times for the energy economics and geopolitics. If people believe that solar(renewable energy) is getting cheaper, the prices of the oil is drop faster. And you don't want to keep holding to oil when the music stops.
I would argue this trend is showing off. The oil producing countries pumping out their oil, because they don't see value reducing the capacity, while the oil prices are historically low.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#63Earlier quoted context omitted.
Those problems you cited all pale in comparison to global warming. It's a disingenuous comparison.
These problems pale in comparison partly because these sustainable forms of technology aren't being used any meaningful scale yet. How much area do we have to cover with solar panels to power a largish metropolitan area?
Depends. If you assume that w/m^2 still have some growth and that solar panels will be as common on houses as front lawns, and that energy efficiency will continue to rise, it may be appreciably near zero; especially if the average future home becomes a net energy source (These are called zero energy buildings, or ZNE) and we still use wind, geothermal, tidal etc...
If you get high deployment in places with high urban sprawl (lots of rooftops), the long term prospects (say 35 years) negative power bills may become the norm - I know a number of people that already have them.
There's been dramatic gains in solar output and power efficiency in the past few years. The trajectories are looking good.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#64Interesting times for the energy economics and geopolitics. If people believe that solar(renewable energy) is getting cheaper, the prices of the oil is drop faster. And you don't want to keep holding to oil when the music stops. I would argue this trend is showing off. The oil producing countries pumping out their oil, because they don't see value reducing the capacity, while the oil prices are historically low.
> And you don't want to keep holding to oil when the music stops.
Or you want to be the only one holding to accessible oil, and pretty much sole provider of oil for plastics and other non-fuel petrochemical products.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#65Earlier quoted context omitted.
> India can develop its solar energy sector by itself. Until the US sues them and the WTO rules against them. http://in.reuters.com/article/usa-india-solar-idINKCN0QV2FD2...
India wants 8% domestic production, and the US has a cry. What a bully. How does the WTO enforce that sort of ruling? India has The Bomb.
America believes in free trade as long as they are able to crush the competition like a bug even before it gets started off the ground.
If you can have local producers that have 8% market share, then they might actually have a sliver of a chance to survive and compete in the market place, and thats unacceptable. Yep, free and fair.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#66Earlier quoted context omitted.
You are correct that every country puts their economy before others. However, India is not asking another economy to help them. India can develop its solar energy sector by itself. The west accuses the developing countries to be big polluters since they use less environmentally-friendly means of energy production. Then when countries like India try to subsidize the domestic solar energy market, WTO accuses them of il…
> India can develop its solar energy sector by itself. Until the US sues them and the WTO rules against them. http://in.reuters.com/article/usa-india-solar-idINKCN0QV2FD2...
can someone explain to me how EU/US can heavy handedly protect their own agriculture and not violate the same rules? How is energy infrastructure not part of the same exemptions (assuming that those exist)?
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#67Whatever the realities of the cost of solar, I tend to worry about a future in which we cover vast swaths of areas with solar panels and the impact such a thing will have on the environment. I don't know if anyone has done good studies on it. A bunch other sustainable forms of energy have environmental problems. Wind generators cause harm to birds, geothermal electricity sources like in Hawai'i raise the temperature…
> I don't know if anyone has done good studies on it.
And why would they! If an industry or country can get an advantage out of a renewable tech, it's not in their interests to fund studies if they could give the wrong answers. That's the reality of it. Biofuel was a good case in point, it's proponents are now back peddling pretty fast. The drive to profit forbids foresight.
You can add diesel cars, electric cars, and CFD, LED bulbs to that list too.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#68With the amount of light we receive here in India, it's a shame this didn't happen sooner.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#69This was in my inbox this morning: http://www.vox.com/2016/4/18/11415510/solar-power-costs-inno... Suggesting that costs are not falling fast enough to overcome value deflation. Seems quite US-focussed though. The numbers in the two articles don't seem directly comparable.
Great article. Sivaram's an impressive kid...
For the near term, financial engineers have not done solar any favors with recent "yieldco" abuses.[1] Though with value deflation, financial innovation and regulatory protection may not be able to save solar.
Re: Solar is now cheaper than some coal, says India energy minister
#70Earlier quoted context omitted.
These problems pale in comparison partly because these sustainable forms of technology aren't being used any meaningful scale yet. How much area do we have to cover with solar panels to power a largish metropolitan area?
The best location for covering a large area of land for purposes of solar energy would arguably be a desert. "90% of the world’s population lives within range of a desert and could be supplied with solar electricity from there", says this article, which also shows you how much needs to be covered to supply the entire globe in theory: http://cleantechnica.com/2009/06/22/half-a-trillion-dollars-...
No it's not.
Solar panels must be free from dust to remain efficient, meaning you have to clean them, frequently, with water...