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The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

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Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#61

Post by awinter-py »

dnautics wrote: post #41
gizmo686 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is also worth remembering that home searches were (and are) very annoying. The type of digital surveillance that is the topic of current 4th amendment debates do not directly inconvenience the person being investigated, so this argument does not apply.

I think part of what made home searches annoying in the colonial era was that they were disproportionately applied to the political opponents of the colonialist status quo. We see those concerns reappear in the modern day in the form of, e.g. loveint, and presumably other pernicious politically motivated investigations. The federal code is so broad as to be able to be used to harass anyone for a legion of infractions…

never heard of LOVEINT before! awesome

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#62

Post by johnloeber »

lbaskin wrote: post #8
bitwize wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obama's reign was never about hope and change; it was always about der Wille zur Macht . Riddle me this -- what if Obama became a Constitutional law professor not so much to study, understand, and teach about the Constitution and its checks on government power, but to give scholarly support to a loose interpretation of the Constitution which does not meaningfully restrain government power ?

As far as I see, he only really taught some fluff courses on "rights, race and gender." [1] Not quite what comes to the minds of most lawyers and law students when someone says "con law professor." [1] http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/30/us/politics/30law.html?pag...

Obama was offered tenure multiple times. Each time, he turned it down. You don't get a tenure offer at UChicago Law by teaching fluff courses.

He apparently focused on the intersection of race and constitutional law.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#63

Post by Crito »

randomgyatwork wrote: post #19
awinter-py wrote: post #2

I was really hoping that barack would be the con-law president. If uchicago hasn't moved down in the rankings because their prof. emeritus is so bad at 'rule of law in practice', there's something wrong with the ranking system. It's shocking to hear a guy who was a professional legal theorist argue that something is legal based on the fact that he ordered the DOJ to write a memo.

I don't think his actions have much to do with what he believes, despite his intentions the government must function as it functions. I think that Obama sincerely wanted to change things, but once he got the power he realized it wasn't possible, or he is a very convincing liar, so convincing that he believes himself what he said.

Controversial politicians, by their very nature, are not convincing liars.

If you want to find examples of convincing liars, you need to look among the people who are universally loved.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#64

Post by [deleted] »

rashkov wrote: post #57
criley2 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"if they had not stirred up the hornet's nest of populism from the right through the healthcare act fiasco" To blame the President for this is ridiculous. Our centrist President promoted a conservative think-tank idea battle tested in the laboratory of a large state, and was ridiculed as a marxist and a communist who was on the level of stalin. No hyperbole, these very attacks and words have become so common in cons…

Well written, thanks. There was a time when the ACA was about a single payer healthcare system. Wouldn't that better explain the red scare accusations of socialism?

[deleted]

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#65

Post by deciplex »

caseysoftware wrote: post #43
Agustus wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When he was elected, I was happy, perhaps he could enact the changes that needed to be made to reign in some of the spying, ridiculous defense contracts, and other items. I based this on the "not red or blue country" speech at the DNC convention. That hope passed quickly when he made the "I won" comment to the Republicans instead of just assuaging or listening to their now valid concerns. I would argue that the obstr…

> I would argue that the obstructionism during the first two years After the 2008 election and until the 2010 election, it was a Democrat House with a Democrat Senate with a Democrat President. It wasn't filibuster-proof (not like they do them anymore anyway) but the Democrats were in charge.

They actually did have a filibuster-proof majority for something like a few months, in between the fight over the Minnesota recount and Senator Kennedy's death. It's pretty much the only time during Obama's Presidency that Congress has been able to get shit done.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#66

Post by argonaut »

wwwdonohue wrote: post #56
School-Cotton wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It wasn't filibuster-proof That's the exact problem, and it almost entirely invalidates your point.

He had the cap on executive bonuses removed while Chuck Grassley was on the floor of the Senate calling for AIG employees to commit suicide before the American people. Pretty remarkable achievement for a President capable of accomplishing very little else save for a pharmaceutical-industry supported healthcare bill.

Where did you find that he had the cap removed? All the sources I can find are that the cap went through.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#67

Post by trill1 »

awinter-py wrote: post #60
wonderlust wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or by people who recognize trolls and no value comments.

That's no ordinary troll. Those comments were synthesized from either a stats distribution or a human using a script. The usernames are similar (dnsjjebw & dnsjkwns), both first time posters, and there's keyword matches between the posts. I think someone's running a chatbot experiment.

The language doesn't look reminiscent of a chatbot to me. It seems that the person made a one-off account, posted something, then thought it didn't go through and made another account and posted again.

Also, Obama is a war criminal, just like W.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#68

Post by rhizome »

wavefunction wrote: post #5
Agustus wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish more university rankings would have the results of their students held against them. An exit test of abilities, logic, and knowledge would be a great ranking system. Additionally, when Presidents claim to be constitution law focused and fail in almost all of the concepts of following the constitution, the professors have failed and the department should be redacted down, similar to the division system in socce…

Perhaps one should consider if a "constitutional scholar" is the perfect candidate to dismantle the Constitution bit by bit rather than someone who holds true to whatever your definitions of "Constitutional" are. I'll admit I voted for the guy the first time, but I was hoping for some significant differences in what we ended up with. Partially the fault of the obstructionist opposing party as well.

At the end of the day, John Yoo has probably studied the Constitution more than Obama, as well as other nameless ones throughout government. For every one of you and me, there are entire graduating classes every year chock full of ideological pushback.

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#69

Post by [deleted] »

School-Cotton wrote: post #46
caseysoftware wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would argue that the obstructionism during the first two years After the 2008 election and until the 2010 election, it was a Democrat House with a Democrat Senate with a Democrat President. It wasn't filibuster-proof (not like they do them anymore anyway) but the Democrats were in charge.

> It wasn't filibuster-proof That's the exact problem, and it almost entirely invalidates your point.

[deleted]

Re: The Obama Administration Has Embraced Legal Theories Broader Than John Yoo's

#70

Post by Retra »

rashkov wrote: post #57
criley2 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"if they had not stirred up the hornet's nest of populism from the right through the healthcare act fiasco" To blame the President for this is ridiculous. Our centrist President promoted a conservative think-tank idea battle tested in the laboratory of a large state, and was ridiculed as a marxist and a communist who was on the level of stalin. No hyperbole, these very attacks and words have become so common in cons…

Well written, thanks. There was a time when the ACA was about a single payer healthcare system. Wouldn't that better explain the red scare accusations of socialism?

Maybe if that single payer system weren't designed (at every step of the way) to enable competition by private industry.
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