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Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

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Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#61

Post by ropiku »

ausjke wrote: post #49
agmohit01 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alright. Let me list down some immigrants who came here on H1B visa. 1. Jyoti Bansal - Founder of AppDynamics The guy in the above mentioned article was on H1B. 2. Kevin Systrom - Cofounder of Instagram was on H1B visa. 3. Jay Scaler - Founder of ZScaler an unicorn, was on H1B visa 4. Vinod Khosla - Founder of Sun Microsystems and well known VC was on H1B visa initially Will list down some more in some time.

In fact H1B has to work for an employer and can not founder a company(at least easily or legally), you have to earn your permanent residence first, which takes quite a few years at least.

Correct. Many don't come right away to make a startup, they work, get contacts&experience and then the startup appears.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#62

Post by foobarqux »

OmarIsmail wrote: post #44
foobarqux wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, he was OPT, at least initially.

OPT doesn't last very long (18 months max I think). The standard path for students is F1->OPT->H1B->Green Card->Citizen.

I suspect he never got an H1-B; his brother was in the US without a visa.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#63

Post by lqdc13 »

staunch wrote: post #6

These are not the downtrodden masses. Immigrant does not mean poor. These are wealthy upper class people coming to the most logical place to create a successful technology company, because they can afford to do so. Poor people are usually stuck wherever they are. Investors in Silicon Valley care a lot about status and pedigree. A foreigner that can afford elite credentials is far more likely to get funding than a poo…

Tons of people who emigrated are poor but are more motivated to take on risk and work on things. Because immigration is taking on risk and because you have to work on documents and push your way through to leave.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#64

Post by chiaro »

staunch wrote: post #6

These are not the downtrodden masses. Immigrant does not mean poor. These are wealthy upper class people coming to the most logical place to create a successful technology company, because they can afford to do so. Poor people are usually stuck wherever they are. Investors in Silicon Valley care a lot about status and pedigree. A foreigner that can afford elite credentials is far more likely to get funding than a poo…

>And of course H1B visas drive down wages. This is basic supply and demand.

In the short run. The increased growth associated with them would typically lead to a general rise in wages in the long run. They also offset the tendency for companies to just move overseas.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#65

Post by [deleted] »

mc32 wrote: post #30
staunch wrote: post #6

These are not the downtrodden masses. Immigrant does not mean poor. These are wealthy upper class people coming to the most logical place to create a successful technology company, because they can afford to do so. Poor people are usually stuck wherever they are. Investors in Silicon Valley care a lot about status and pedigree. A foreigner that can afford elite credentials is far more likely to get funding than a poo…

First, educated and immigrants of means are a great addition to any economy they go to and a drain to the economies they leave. It's understandable why educated people might want to leave a country with few economic opportunities for their careers. What I'm not so clear on is what attracts educated people of means to emigrate to the US [and AU and UK] from otherwise stable mature economies? We're better off for them,…

[deleted]

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#66

Post by moistgorilla »

chiaro wrote: post #64
staunch wrote: post #6

These are not the downtrodden masses. Immigrant does not mean poor. These are wealthy upper class people coming to the most logical place to create a successful technology company, because they can afford to do so. Poor people are usually stuck wherever they are. Investors in Silicon Valley care a lot about status and pedigree. A foreigner that can afford elite credentials is far more likely to get funding than a poo…

>And of course H1B visas drive down wages. This is basic supply and demand. In the short run. The increased growth associated with them would typically lead to a general rise in wages in the long run. They also offset the tendency for companies to just move overseas.

This is not true. Unchecked immigration is always a negative for native workers. It can be accurately described as wealth redistribution from workers to the companies that employee them.

They cause $515 billion in losses for native workers and $565 billion gains for native businesses. Look at the chart on page 9

https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/03-16-16%20Bo...

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#67

Post by ori_b »

belltaco wrote: post #12
pandaman wrote: post #7

The article is advocating for increasing H1-B caps. I wonder what does H1-B (a non-immigrant visa, which does not allow running your own business) has to do with immigrants founding billion dollar startups other than them using it to acquire cheap labor?

Because many of them came to the US to study because of being able to work here through the OPT/H1/GreenCard/citizen route. Same with many top professors, researchers and tech execs like Nadella, Gundotra, Pichai etc.And many people on this list too like the inventor of USB etc. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Indian_Americans

> Same with many top professors, researchers and tech execs like Nadella, Gundotra, Pichai etc.And many people on this list too like the inventor of USB etc.

Some of them might have, but the H1B is an awful avenue for this. You are not allowed any side businesses while you are employed on an H1B visa (and you can't be self employed using it). If you are Indian, you are looking at what is currently an 11 year processing delay before you can get a green card, not counting the time it takes to get your H1B initially. If you're from other countries, the backlog is shorter, but it is still multiple years before you can leave your company to try self employment.

Assuming you get approved for a green card. It's possible to get an H1B and then get denied for a green card.

Academics and other similar figures of note can already apply directly for a green card, which I suspect many of the people on this list have done. If you want to expand immigration, a simpler, faster path to permanent residency is essential.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#68

Post by Robelius »

lqdc13 wrote: post #63
staunch wrote: post #6

These are not the downtrodden masses. Immigrant does not mean poor. These are wealthy upper class people coming to the most logical place to create a successful technology company, because they can afford to do so. Poor people are usually stuck wherever they are. Investors in Silicon Valley care a lot about status and pedigree. A foreigner that can afford elite credentials is far more likely to get funding than a poo…

Tons of people who emigrated are poor but are more motivated to take on risk and work on things. Because immigration is taking on risk and because you have to work on documents and push your way through to leave.

Immigrants are a self-selecting group. The barriers you have to cross leave the most motivated individuals/families capable of coming here. The immigrating generation, at least from my experience, come with the intention of setting up their children with better possibilities. Their lives revolve around making their kids hard workers in school, which transfers over into their character.

There's a joke in my community between the younger generation that we all had two choices after high school. You could choose to be a lawyer or doctor. If your parents were kind, then you could be an engineer.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#69

Post by bruceb »

Kenji wrote: post #8

According to the study, Mr. Bansal couldn’t leave his job to start a new company because it was unclear if he’d be able to keep his H-1B status. For 7 years. What a lock-in. And during that time, your employer can probably abuse you and freeze your salary, knowing exactly that your stay depends on that visa and you have a hard time leaving. Another point on immigrants. The US does it right: It causes brain-drain in o…

H1-B visa holders can switch jobs.

Re: Study: Immigrants Founded 51% of U.S. Billion-Dollar Startups

#70

Post by chiaro »

moistgorilla wrote: post #66
chiaro wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>And of course H1B visas drive down wages. This is basic supply and demand. In the short run. The increased growth associated with them would typically lead to a general rise in wages in the long run. They also offset the tendency for companies to just move overseas.

This is not true. Unchecked immigration is always a negative for native workers. It can be accurately described as wealth redistribution from workers to the companies that employee them. They cause $515 billion in losses for native workers and $565 billion gains for native businesses. Look at the chart on page 9 https://www.judiciary.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/03-16-16%20Bo...

This is misrepresenting the data. The majority of economists and the relevant literature agree that allowing more freedom of immigration improves the welfare of American worker. This is ignoring the huge benefits to the immigrants themselves. To appeal to what I imagine HN's ideology is, the arguments are similar to those around making the market more free--when you prevent buyers and sellers from making transactions they otherwise would, you inhibit growth.

Only 9% of economists disagree with the statement: "The average US citizen would be better off if a larger number of low-skilled foreign workers were legally allowed to enter the US each year."

http://www.igmchicago.org/igm-economic-experts-panel/poll-re...

0% of economists disagree with the statement: "The average US citizen would be better off if a larger number of highly educated foreign workers were legally allowed to immigrate to the US each year."

http://www.igmchicago.org/igm-economic-experts-panel/poll-re...

EDIT, since we're at the reply limit: Borjas is kind of heterodox, and without the chance now to do a better review of his literature I'm inclined to sided with the fairly overwhelming consensus. Picking two graphs that look similar isn't really a convincing argument, and 'redistribution' implies that this is a zero-sum change.

My position generally is that H-1B's (and whatever *-1B you suggest) would generally be good for the economy, though suffer from implementation issues and unnecessary restrictions.

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